lincoln vs. miller

In comparing these two welders in the MIG category, it seems that the
Lincoln 215 compared to the Miller 210 needs a lot more attachments to weld
aluminum. Same for the Lincoln 255 vs. the Miller 251. The Miller
advertises "Gun on Demand", where I don't see that for the Lincoln. Seems
to me that Miller would be the smarter choice. Opinions. Also, I
occasionally see a welder advertised on Ebay called the Electrimig SA that
looks like it has "Gun on Demand" also. Does anyone have any knowledge of
this welder. Looks to be foreign made from what the web-site says.
thanks
Reply to
stonecreek
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across the entire line the miller is a better value and in my opinion, an all around better machine. although i realize in the end thats all that matters (from a business standpoint anyway) i also like the fact that millers are still built here by regular joe american workers. lincoln shipped their entire operation to mexico where they can get cheap labor. if theyre willing to ship an american industry to mexico to save a buck, it makes me wonder what other corners theyre willing to cut to save another buck and i want nothing to do with them.
i encourage you to read
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for more on why i feel the way i feel.
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
When did Lincoln make the move to Mexico?
Rex the Wrench
Nathan W. Collier wrote:
Reply to
Rex the Wrench
By entire operation, do you mean all 31 plants, in 19 countries? If so, when did it happen? I know they have two plants in Torreon Mexico, I believe that both produce for the Mexico, Central and South American markets. If they are exporting to the U.S. I would like to know what products and when they started. When did the Mentor, Ohio plant shut down and move to Mexico? They were running as of spring 2002. Where is the headquarters building now? Not in Cleaveland? Did they close all the plants in China, Germany, Phillipines, Russia, ect. and move them to Mexico? I would assume they did when you say "entire operation". Please give information that backs this up, I would be very interested in seeing it.
JTMcC.
Reply to
JTMcC
im not sure when, but go look at the new lincolns. every one ive found says "made in mexico"
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
i dont pretend to know everything about their company, but i can make it real easy for you. go to your own welding distributor and look on the new lincolns. they all say "made in mexico".
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
That is not what you said in your previous post, you said " lincoln shipped their entire operation to mexico to save a buck" that is a direct quote. I'm asking if you can back that statement up with fact? By "entire operation", do you mean all 31 plants, in 19 countries? If not, then what do you mean by entire operation?
JTMcC.
Reply to
JTMcC
i missed that part the first time through. i am referencing manufacturing. since the original machine in question was the millermatic 210 lets look at the comparison sheet. i realize that this is from the competition but i dont think they would directly lie over something that could be disproven so easily.
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look at the 5th category, "manufacturing location"
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
would you stop trying to find any technicality you can? OBVIOUSLY the ENTIRE operation has not moved. my statement clearly discussed where the machines in question are manufactured. see 5th category under
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Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
i think we can both agree that much as been shown by this point, right?
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
i also like the fact that
Although the PowerMig 200 was being built in Mexico, the 215 (200 replacement) is now being built back here in the states, please be aware of this. I know this because I used to work at Lincoln. Now I run a repair facility that is authorized for both Lincoln and Miller. I still quite frequently talk to many of my former co-workers there.
From the standpoint of service, I can tell you from a bit of personal experience that most Miller machines in fact ARE easier to work on/troubleshoot. Miller has better habits when it comes to marking up their wiring diagrams, too. However, Lincoln stills puts out a pretty good product also. With the exception of certain machines (Miller's Tigs) I feel anymore that it is chevy/ford-like....which color do you like better?
By the way, for what it is worth....I still maintain very close contact with the factory/headquarters here in Cleveland, and we very frequently have PowerMigs (200, 215, 255, & 300's) that come to us from the field. These were machines that for whatever reason (loaned out, demo, classes, etc.) have come back to us for refurb/resale as used units. If anyone out there is interested in one, at VERY good prices I might add, drop me a line. Don't use the email up above, use this one: snipped-for-privacy@ameritech.net These are machines that we get back, repair as needed, and re-equip with gun/drive rolls/tips/regulator as needed to make them like a new one. BUT, because they have been out already, sell for USED prices. Let me know if interested.
I don't mean to use this thread for free advertising! I was coming in to give my opinion on something, and what the heck, if some guys can save a few bucks....COOL! As always, this is an excellent forum for exchanging news and tips!
Reply to
PHIL
No, maybe you should put on your pink welding shirt and build another one of those illegal extension cords! !>
JTMcC.
Reply to
JTMcC
just curious, when did that change? when i bought my 210 last march the lincolns had the "made in mexico" on them (planned on buying miller anyway, but did a comparison first). although they were a little cheaper, that was all i needed to read to rule it out.
agreed. either will serve you well.
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
... miller rules (this is my OPINION), and they ARE made right here in the USA. Buy what you want, everyone has a preference for one reason or another, but Nathan welds with Miller equipment and they are the tools that he makes his living with. The original post asked for opinions, he gave his based on his experience, and the lincoln DOES have made in mexico on the label, the miller does not. walt
Reply to
wallster
Unfortunately, Miller may not be able to continue manufacturing in the USofA. Wages and burden, worker safety regulations, worker legislated job conditions protection, environmental protection, and other cost factors are way lower 'off shore.' The trend toward shipping jobs to low-cost countries will continue. The change, methinks, is akin to the change from a farm-based to industrial-based employment that took place through the late 1800s to mid 1900s. That one could not be stopped and this one cannot either. The problem this time around is that there do not appear to be replacement gigs for lost manufacturing, programming, etc., jobs.
These are not cheerful thoughts.
Ciao, David Todtman
Reply to
David Todtman
miller has marketed their "made in the usa" so hard that to change that now would be detrimental.
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier
other than where they were made, here is what I like to add:
l used to LINCOLN in the past, and and now moved to miller MIG , I can say i have hard time adjusting to millers wirefeed speed/ voltage compansating feature on the miller wire speed control knob is not the only thing that controls wire speed . wire speed depends on voltage setting as well. on the lincoln I could change heat and wire speed with out ever looking at the chat on the machine and be on the spot. with the miller I need to stick close to the chart on the side panel
here is a visual example: loading the wire in to the gun miller: crank the wire fed to max ---- the wire barely feeds, now crank up the voltage and the wire is jamming (fast)
may be it is just me or may be because I am new to miller. I recall some one else was mentioning NOT liking this feature on the miller. oh welll just have to live with it.
Reply to
acrobat-ants
Many companies manage just fine. Multiple options for this, all of which have been seen. Designed in USA; built to USA standards; USA office address of company prominently displayed; (country of actual manufacture in tiny type, or not mentioned at all, for all the above).
Made in USA [by having minimum wage, part time, no-benefits workers, who will be imported from Mexico with the blessings of the current administration "assemble" "subassemblies" made in other places (plug Wire A into Slot B, tighten Screw C)].
Reply to
Ecnerwal
If one gave up everything not made and grown in the USA, it would eliminate a VERRY high % of our choices. We say, "BUY US", but eat produce and fruits from out of the USA We love cheap foreign consumer electronics products. We buy inexpensive textiles from abroad. Even our high dollar US symbolic running shoes are made with the effort of low paid employees in foreign countries. We ride foreign made motorcycles and ATVs.
Just the facts, maam............
STEve
Reply to
SteveB
i agree. that said, ill always buy american if an american comparable product is available even at slightly higher cost. on many things you dont have a choice but when i do i will support the american worker every time IF the quality of his work is at least as good as the foreign product. in the case of miller i feel they are one of the _few_ companies left (like caterpillar) who still look at ways of making their product better before they try to make it cheaper.
interesting thing about that is that honda/yamaha/kawasaki/suzuki are all built here in the united states by U.S. workers while our own domestic products (ford/dodge/chevy) are being built in mexico/canada and imported here.
Reply to
Nathan W. Collier

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