scanning plans

You do realize that printing out a copy for your friend is illegal, if the plans are copyrighted. It violates copyright law. Your friend needs to purchase his own copy from the rightful copyright owner, or the copyright police will come and drag you both away in the night.

I'm the person from whom Bill got the plans in the first place, so yell at me! However, the plans are no longer available, and there is no copyright statement on the originals. Also, no money changed hands, so no violation occurred. Now, per Bill's method of reducing/reproducing, it worked superbly!

Geoff Sanders

snipped-for-privacy@rochester.rr.com wrote:

Both those facts are irrelevant to the question of whether a copyright violation has taken place.

So is this.

I'm glad everything went well :-) If you need me to send you a file baked in a cake for your escape then just post your cell number here :-)

Geoff,

The fact that there is no copyright notice on the print is irrelavant. Neither is the fact that no money changed hands. Neither is the fact that it is no longer produced.

Copyright is automatic. Adding the statement is not necessary. Reproducing the item has potentially deprived the owner of income.

Those things have no bearing on this issue. Making a copy is a violation of the IP owners copyright.

And now you too have violated the IP owners copyright. If you want to do this at least have the common sense to keep it to yourself and don't post a confession in a NG! Sign, me

Very well, if the owner of Nexus Plan #1740, which I purchased through Traplett some years ago, but which is no longer available, will step forward, I'll be happy to pay him for two additional copies of his plan. Since you live in the UK and I don't, perhaps you can track him down. The designer was Tim Royce. I'm NOT out to scam or rip anyone off, but if there's no way to get plans any other way than to make copies individually, that's what I'll do.

So is Bill to walk over to Geoff's house ( god only knows the distance ) and build his model there???? So how about if Geoff sends his plans (original) via snail-mail to borrow???

Mike

Geoff, I see no way that you are out to scam or rip off anyone...........you are doing them a service.

Mike

This is most unlikely to be a requirement of the original licence ;-)

Depends on the licence that came with the plan. I know of kayak plans that only permit a single kayak to be made fro the planset. If you want to make more than one there is a supplement to pay for each extra unit. AIUI this is common in the full-size boat and house building world.

I've never known this to apply to a plan for a toy aeroplane though and in the UK at least I believe you can't impose a restriction like that unless it is part of the original sales agreement.

Your all gonna die for this?

Gezz getreal --- you guys!!!!

Copyright is not automatic, you have to register with the US Copyright office in the States. If there is no copyright you can print or sell all you want!

There is not right if the owner did not register or place a warning or licence on the drawing.

Opps getting this mixed up with trademarks. But you can copy all you want for your own use if there is no statement otherwise, if you paid for them, and if whomever you got them from paid the owner. But giving a copy to your friend is not legal.

Got this wrong. See my other post.

Sport Pilot wrote: But you can copy all you want for your own use if there is no statement otherwise, if you paid for them, and if whomever you got them from paid the owner. No. You are permitted to make ONE copy only for personal use. Another poster here is right, copyright exists from the time the work is first created, but it's damned hard to prove without an actual copyright being filed.

There's a Hun in the sun!

You can make as many copies as needed for personal use. No such law in the books. However if there is a statement on the plans or in the kit, that is a differant matter.

I agree, if I take a picture with my camera, it does not automaticall

mean that no one can use it without my permission and that it i protected by law. Kind of like patent law, you have to do something t protect it from free use or theft of an idea. If you copy a trim schem from a full size aircraft to your model, are you going to jail? Don` think so, and do copywrights expire like patents? Like old softwar that eventually becomes public domain.. Look at the model kit makers. how many Ugly Stick designs were really just slight mods of Phil Kraft original... MW sweet stick

-- skylane4

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this thread:

| I agree, if I take a picture with my camera, it does not automatically | mean that no one can use it without my permission and that it is | protected by law. Kind of like patent law, you have to do something to | protect it from free use or theft of an idea.

[ Note: Everything I say here is specific to the US. ]

Um, you're confusing patents with trademarks. Trademarks are what need to be protected, not patents, and not copyrights.

| If you copy a trim scheme from a full size aircraft to your model, | are you going to jail? Don`t think so, and do copywrights expire | like patents?

Yes, copyrights do eventually expire, unless you're Disney and can keep buying extensions from Congress.

In any event, copyright infringement is usually a civil matter, not a criminal one. So you get sued rather than going to jail.

| Like old software that eventually becomes public domain.

The only computer software that I can see that would have become public domain because it's copyright has expired would be that which was published before _1963_ and the copyright was not renewed. Yes, all computer software should eventually enter the public domain, but it's going to be a while.

If you're wondering about copyright durations in the US --

If you're wondering about the various forms of intellectual property protections in the US --

Please, if you can't at least skim over all the information out there on IP law, don't try to pass yourself off as an expert. IP law is complicated, and not always related to common sense.

(And no, I'm not a lawyer.)

| Look at the model kit makers.. how many Ugly Stick designs were | really just slight mods of Phil Krafts original... MW sweet stick?

On some level, all planes are slight mods on some other plane out there ...

In any event, it looks like a `Design Patent' (look at the second link I gave you) could cover a specific type of model airplane, say the Ugly Stick. However, getting a patent is expensive -- how many model airplanes have been patented? I doubt the number is very high, at least not until you start getting into the commercial/military UAV area. And even if the Ugly Stick had been patented, it would have expired by now (only being valid for 14 years.)

Oh yes it does. Copyright is automatic and unless there are special circumstances it resides with the creator of the art. In this case you as the photographer automatically gain copyright protection just by pressing the shutter release.

Nope. Not since the Berne convention.