A new face mill...

Here is Kriss Hogg (Mr. P.V.) showing what he really does best... Lie
http://www.aperfectdealer.com/nbnews/fall_04_vol3/story4.html
"Kristofer Hogg holds degrees in physics, chemistry, and nutrition, is a Registered Dietitian, and has an extensive background in machining and manufacturing processes. He did PhD research in Enzyme Kinetics, and developed the HoloBarre Fitness/Rehab/Stretching System, which should be available through physical therapists, personal fitness trainers, and dance schools by the end of 2001. You can email him questions/comments on health/nutrition/fitness as well as other inquiries to: snipped-for-privacy@erols.com"
Extensive background in machining and manufacturing processes... what a crock of shit. Kriss Hogg has never worked as a machinist, has no CADCAM background, never went to trade school for machining, etc.
Kriss Hogg has spent years hiding behind an alias attacking others far more skilled than he is at machining and with CADCAM.
Jon Banquer San Diego, CA http://jonbanquer.blogspot.com /
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On Jul 13, 11:07am, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Jon, why do you constantly switch between your Larry and Jon accounts?
Why do you even have a "Larry" account? What is the purpose? Giving your Jon Banquer posts 5 star ratings?
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Here is Kriss Hogg (Mr. P.V.) showing what he really does best... Lie
http://www.aperfectdealer.com/nbnews/fall_04_vol3/story4.html
"Kristofer Hogg holds degrees in physics, chemistry, and nutrition, is a Registered Dietitian, and has an extensive background in machining and manufacturing processes. He did PhD research in Enzyme Kinetics, and developed the HoloBarre Fitness/Rehab/Stretching System, which should be available through physical therapists, personal fitness trainers, and dance schools by the end of 2001. You can email him questions/comments on health/nutrition/fitness as well as other inquiries to: snipped-for-privacy@erols.com"
Extensive background in machining and manufacturing processes... what a crock of shit. Kriss Hogg has never worked as a machinist, has no CADCAM background, never went to trade school for machining, etc.
Kriss Hogg has spent years hiding behind an alias attacking others far more skilled than he is at machining and with CADCAM.
Jon Banquer San Diego, CA http://jonbanquer.blogspot.com /
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On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 12:41:11 -0400, "Proctologically Violated"

Sandvik CoroMill 390 endmill, 1" square shoulder cutter, three inserts.

Ditto, 2" - five inserts
We do precious little face milling. If we did, I would list the 2" first.
--

-JN-

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Proctologically Violated wrote:

I find a 2" square shoulder cutter very useful, not only for face milling but rough profiling too.
Wayne...
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On Jul 13, 12:41pm, "Proctologically Violated"

PV, this is an easy one to fit the ticket. Try out this link http://www.iscar.com/Ecat/familyHDR.asp/fnum/787/app/61/mapp/ML/GFSTYP/I/type/1/lang/EN
to Iscar's Chammill. One body can use round, Square, Octogon or 45 Degree Lead inserts. They can be purchased in a kit with samples of each insert. Talk to your local Iscar Rep about selecting the proper grade and chipbreaker for what make sense for you on a day in and day out type of routine. Before you know it you will have a varoety of inserts that ALL fit into 1 body.
Round inserts work great as you said the amount of cutting edge surface is huge and very economical. I think you will get 8 "timed" indexes as the insert uses the same configuration on the back for all shapes. So just as you would get 8 cutting edges from the Octogon insert I believe you will for the round ones also.
Obviously you use the Square Shouldered 90 Degree Lead insert when you need to achieve the square, but these are the least economical.
Where you can really make some time is the Octogon and 45 Degree Lead insert. Due to the 45 degree lead angle you create a thinner chip thus resulting in about 30% less Horsepower consumption. So if you are just slabbing off material and can use the 45 degree or Octogon shape you take your feedrates that much (30% higher) and reduce the cycletime .
If the cutter body offers insert that have a wiper on them, try them out. But if you are attempting to get a smoother finish DO NOT Slow the feedrate DOWN. In fact keeping it cruising right along. The flat (wiper) built into the insert edge should be slightly more than the other inserts total Inch Per Rev feedrate. So when the Wiper makes contact with the part it smooths out the tool marks from the corner radius of the previous inserts all at one time. So even though you are cruising along at an aggressive feedrate, you achieve a nice finish too. In fact if you slow it down it will probably chatter due to the tool pressure the wiper is creating when rubbing instead of cutting.
For versatility in Facemilling, The Iscar ChamMill is the choice for me. If you have more specific needs, there are several nice cutters on the market today.
One of the last ones I put into play for aluminum that needed to be smooth used PCD diamond tipped inserts, 1 diamond tipped wiper and a Shower Screw that uses through the spindle coolant down through the cutter body and thru the end of the mounting screw that has holes in it. So the centrifugal force of the spinning cutter body forced the coolant from under the cutter body blowing chips away from the cut thus eliminating the chance of a chip getting re-cut and marring the surface.
Coolant on Facemills in general is not a good practice due to not being able to flood the entire cutter due to it's size. So the inserts are constantly going through Thermal Shock resulting in fracturing, resulting in bad experiences with Facemilling.
http://www.mmsonline.com/articles/0105ex1.html facemilling at it's best. Check out the brush burning up as the heat hits it. Watch the heat disipate from the pile of chips at the end of the video.
JR
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JRWheels wrote:

http://www.iscar.com/Ecat/familyHDR.asp/fnum/787/app/61/mapp/ML/GFSTYP/I/type/1/lang/EN
I've run these in the vintage of Fadal that PV has described. The 2" diameter cutter body was about right for that class of horse power and rigidity and we always rigged up the coolant line to run air on this tool. Worked great.
The newer HT 50 taper Fadal is another animal but he doesn't have one of those.
--

John R. Carroll
www.machiningsolution.com
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Proctologically Violated wrote:

PV, I have a 3" face mill that uses 3/8 IC parallelogram inserts. This type of insert will let you machine 90 square corners. The inserts come in up sharp ground configuration for alum. and negative rake inserts for steels etc. I also have an 1 1/2" dia on a 3/4 shank for smaller work. I like the fact that I can get the positive rake alum inserts in .005 radius, which I've used if I have a thin wall.
Shell mills or face mills used to be $100 an inch of dia. but times have changed.
Best, Steve
--


Regards,
Steve Saling
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Proctologically Violated wrote:

PV:
    We've got a bunch of face mills from different manufacturers, from 2" to about 8", and from 2 inserts to 8 inserts.
    If I had to choose which one would be the most versatile if I were limited to just one, I would probably choose the following:
==================================================================http://www.iscar.com/Ecat/search.asp
F45KT HELIOCTO 45 face mills, using octagonal and round inserts. =================================================================    Ours is a 3" one (a little less at the bottom of the 45 degree insert area). With the polished inserts for aluminum it plows through aluminum, brass, and plastic stock like crazy and leaves a good finish. With the inserts for steel installed, it machines most everything else, (303, 304, 316, 17-4 stainless, Kovar, 1018, etc.). The inserts are octagonal so you get 8 edges. You can also get round inserts if you want, we have some but rarely use them. And this is on low horsepower Fadals and Haas.
    We have some face mills that are better in aluminum, and some Tangmill face mills that are better in steel, but you only get to use 2-4 insert edges, so they probably wouldn't be as economical. Unless you bought an extra left hand turning Tangmill facemill so you could use the other 4 sides of the Tangmill inserts. Which we have, but that probably wouldn't be a costsaving feature you'd be interested in.
    Tell Iscar that BottleBob referred you, so I can get a kickback.     Just kidding, I get nothing, not even a free insert. LOL
    
--
BottleBob
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==========================================>
Bob, There is a newer version of the TANGMILL that positions the insert on the bottom of the cutter laying it flat which you can then utilize the other 2 corners, truly getting the benefits of all 4 corners now.
JR
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JRWheels wrote:

Jim:
    You mean these:
==================================================================http://www.iscar.com/Ecat/search.asp
F86LNX-11 86 face milling cutter on which all 8 cutting edges of the TANGMILL inserts can be used.
F86LNX-15 86 face milling cutter on which all 8 cutting edges of the TANGMILL inserts can be used. =================================================================    When you use the Tangmill inserts in a regular toolholder you get to use 4 corners, since the screw mounting hole is chamfered on both sides.
    The bottom feeder idea is pretty cool as it makes use of the other 4 sides in one tool.
--
BottleBob
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http://www.sumicarbide.com/pdf/mill/Mill_UFOR.pdf
--


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over a barrel wrote:

OAB:
    Looking at the site you gave above, I see the following listing for inserts:
==================================================Note: use "SNS" for Steel applications use "SNI" for Inconel applications use "SNT" for Titanium applications =================================================    I don't see any listed specifically for alum.
    Going to the main Sumitomo milling site I see this info for their Metal Slash Mills:
===================================================http://www.sumicarbide.com/prodline_milling.htm
Metal Slash Mills (PDF) The unique design of our Metal Slash Mill directs cutting forces into the machine spindle to achieve feed rates of up to 0.078 IPT, even in low rigidity conditions. A four-corner insert (screw on assembly) design yields low tooling costs per part. U.S. stock bodies are available in 2.000 - 4.000 diameters. Available with CVD and PVD coated grades. ==================================================    I noticed the .078" chip load per insert in CARBON STEEL. That seems quite radical! Even at their lowest recommendation of 500 SFPM on a 2" dia. face mill that would be 955 RPM and at a chip load of .078" per tooth (4 inserts) would equate to a feedrate of 297 IPM!     And at their upper recommended limit of 820 SFM - that would be an RPM of 1,566, and a feedrate of 488 IPM, in the same carbon steel no less.     Man, those would be some machine gun like chips flying off that cutter, probably chip the paint right off the machine's inner sheet metal panels. LOL
--
BottleBob
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Actually just bought it recently haven't tested yet inserts are yet an even higher clearance angle than what I currently have on hand...anyways this is very similar to the kennametal line #mcf-45 of which I have several, the geometry is positive axial negative radial together this design allow for quite acceptable tool life and very rapid removal rates even when using lighter weight machines and low horsepower.
--



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