It had to happen

In the states they are a fire code in most areas. I typically try to get people to let me fit a key permanently in place for nominal charge on existing ones especially where they are installed on a solid door where they serve little purpose.

I used to live in an apartment that got broken into twice. After the second time, the landlord put in a double cylinder lock for added security, since there was a large window on the outside door. A month later the code enforcement officer came along for the yearly income property inspection that landlords have to go through, and ordered her to get rid of the lock since it was a fire code violation. She did so and boarded up the window.

This kind of thing costs lives... Maybe the "insurance industry" in Australia should consider requiring mandatory burglar alarm systems in residential occupancies rather than locks which need keys on both sides to open... LOL... Ever see a typical family home, most fo the time people can't find their keys when they don't need them to OPEN the door to get out... Ok, now try looking for your keys in a room full of smoke, or one that is on fire... Remember, you will die if you can't find them... Just to put that kind of thing into perspective...

Even fitting a key permanently in place is still a violation of the fire code in the State of Massachusetts... Use of locks that require a key on the inside to open the door require special consideration from the fire department and are never allowed on doors that serve as an egress in residential occupancies...

Doing something like putting a double cylinder deadbolt on a door in the name of security risks lives, and in the end is more harmful than they will ever be protective... I don't care how big the window next to the door is, is that lock worth someone's life ??? Install an alarm if you feel unsafe in your home, don't lock the door on yourself, as one day you might find yourself wanting a key that you can't find in an emergency...

As a professional locksmith you should actively encourage (even if it means refusing to service such locks) the removal of such locking devices as you come across them... Trust me, because some day a grieving relative will sue a locksmith somewhere for negligence... (And being that you served the lock, by being the last person to alter/touch it and NOT recommending it be removed, it could be argued to a jury in a civil court that you may have contributed to any harm done to the occupants who could not escape due to the double cylinder lock on the door...) Don't be a victim of jackpot justice...

Evan the Maintenance Man

Cite?

A lock with a key slam keyed in place essentially has a thumb turn.

That's open to debate and really should be left to the occupants rather than mandated one way or the other by anyone.

I don't care how big the window next to the door is,

That's the same argument proponents of double cylinders use.

Are you a maintenance man or a lawyer? You also need to read what is posted. I never said I recomended to people the installation of that setup. I said the opposite. In certain situations I don't see a problem with it and neither do millions of other people which is why double cylinders exist. I just don't reccomend it for residential applications. As far as jackpot justice and lawsuits in general it isn't difficult to make yourself virtually immune from legal judgements and to do so completely legally.

hey Steve, maybe you know who, needs to also incorporate the phrase: "don't lock it and lose it " :-) g'day Steve

Two sections of the building code apply to this instance...

They are covered under 780 CMR 3603.10 which apply to One and Two family dwellings and are:

780 CMR 3603.10.3 Door Hardware: Double Cylinder deadbolts requiring a key operation on both sides are prohibited on required means of egress doors serving more than one dwelling unit.

780 CMR 3603.10.4 Emergency egress from sleeping rooms: Sleeping rooms shall have at least one openable window or exterior door approved for emergency egress or rescue in each room. The units shall be operable from the inside to a full clear opening without the use fo a key or tool. Emergency escape windows, under 780 CMR 3603.10.4 shall have a sill height of not more than 44 inches above the floor.

Some cities and towns have gone further to define each bedroom as a dwelling unit...

Not it is not, it is still by design a DOUBLE CYLINDER lock and prohibited by direct langauge in the building code. How often do keys break off in a lock ??? Could someone in a panic attempting exit from a building with a double cylinder deadbolt break off that "key slam keyed in place" and then have difficulty operating that lock to escape ???

The funny thing about that argument is that you can still escape your home without a key when your doorlocks are not double cylinder... Now it doesn't matter if you are running from fire, smoke, an intruder, some kind of animal that got into your house... Whatever... Very difficult to open the door when its locked with a double cylinder deadbolt when you don't have your keys...

If you are in business you should be more like a lawyer... As to your "making yourself virtually immune from legal judgements" you can't do this in every situation with standard disclaimers...

Evan the Maintenance Man

Thank you. That's what I was looking for. What is the definition of "required means of egress" doors? How many does a dwelling have to have. e.g. you have a townhouse with 1 solid exterior door and one exterior door with glass panes. Is a double cylinder permitted if used ONLY on the one with the glass and not on the solid door ( where it's of little benefit anyway)?

Highly doubtful. About as likely as breaking the thumb turn on alot of cheap deadbolts which would probably happen after the bolt were thrown anyway.

That's not the argument in I was referring to. The argument I was referring to is that installing a thumbturn lock instead of a double cylinder out of fear of not being able to exit in a fire is not worth the risk if someone can easily break the window and open the door.

Now it doesn't

Ah but that's an assumption. There is no reason the key can't be in a known place out of reach of a smashed window pane. There is also no reason at least in many dwellings why all exits would have to have the same setup.

I'm not talking about disclaimers, although they are the first step. I'm talking about how assets are structured and more importantly who, or what, owns the assets on paper (which is what counts).

uh oh! All of my bedrooms have just one window, and each has a window air conditioner installed, with a bracket screwed into the window sill to help prevent accidental opening and burglaries. But I don't live in Massachusetts. I wonder how many people in Massachusetts though live in similar situations. I would suspect quite a few, especially if the bedroom is on an upper floor, where it gets hotter. I also wonder if simply unscrewing the security bracket and leaving the A/C unit in place would allow this to comply with code? Of course, I can imagine A/C units falling from the sky then onto people below when opening the window in a panic.

I can vouch for this one. One time I had a key in the door, and was attempting to carry a heavy item inside. The item hit the key, causing it to break off with the keyway part still in the cylinder. I had to call a locksmith to come over to extract it. He charged only $35 or $40. This was back in 1994 though, in the daytime, and he was only a few miles away, fortunately. Good deal!

That particular section is derived from the National Building Code and applicable to be enforced in all 50 states in the US... You should look into it in your area and determine if you are endangering your life by having these things blocking your windows in violation of this code...

Well at least it is known to happen by other people as well, rather than just by me... The language in the code clearly prohibits double cylinder locks...

good point, but at the same time, one of the bedrooms is in what is technically a third-floor attic, and the window A/C unit blocks the only fire escape window (which is in that bedroom). The problem though is that it becomes swelteringly-hot in the summer, and I like to close the bedroom door at night. And there are no other windows to use. So it's a choice between dying of heat or blocking the window. I could always keep a screwdriver and flashlight nearby in case of emergency though. I know: it's not safe, but for all practical purposes, I don't want to have to die of heat. I could always put a ladder against the bathroom window instead, which is on the opposite side of the attic.

the poor girl was an aboriginal who couldn't afford blankets.........they were huddled around a heater........ which caught fire... her man/father of the children is in jail for asssault charges........ and they say she wouln't have deadlocked it were her man home.......

And she didn't leave the key in the indoor cylinder? Guess not.