Re: $50 Device Doubles Mileage: Isn't It Another #$%^& Scam?

Dear John:

Did I say it didn't? "What if" on the power stroke, the piston drove a ratchet and pawl mechanism, and the entire power stoke fired directly into rotating the crank? Instead of spending

45deg of travel just bending steel? It's only a "mechanical problem".

You start first. Rather than sniping.

David A. Smith

Still indirect, with the pressurized face at an angle other than

90 deg to the crank for the full stroke.

But you knew that, and decided to pop in anyway.

David A. Smith

"N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)" wrote in news:qZb5k.1565 $ snipped-for-privacy@newsfe10.phx:

Wow you must drive at full throttle a lot.

That or your car is fitted with a special sensor that can detect the difference between an obstruction in the intake caused by a butterrfly, and an obstruction caused by a clogged filter.

Mine isn't.

Cheers

Greg Locock

The greenest of all is the low cost electric bicycle.

Recently someone had a sale, $200 for both the battery and the 26" hub mounted motor wheel, top unassisted speed was 15 mph, range, 15 miles.

Bret Cahill

Dear Greg Locock:

No, actually. I try to keep rpms always below 3K.

None are. But changing my filter element took me from 25 mpg to almost 30 mpg, between the filter and me driving differently because the engine ran better. And it wasn't that dirty. Possible the mechanic that replaced the filter, "fixed" something else...

David A. Smith

Dear Bret Cahill:

A significant amount of fossil fuels is involved in making it. So it really isn't "greenest", the bicycle alone would be. Or a wooden tricycle. Or a stone wheel. Or an ox dragging a litter.

David A. Smith

To get a number you'ld have to do the entire carbon and energy balances.

In high petroleum consumption agriculture countries, the electric bike beats everything.

Bret Cahill

No actually most are. It is called Throttle Position Sensor (TPS)

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FWIW, I tried an electric bike. Its main virtue was assist on serious hills, otherwise it added a lot of bulk that was counter productive. Keep in mind that this was an in-hub motor which was a rather bad choice. Perhaps when I get older I will appreciate it more. I'm only sixty-two now.

That's it, or possibly a copy of it.

The closest I've come to "free energy" was when I fell down a very steep hill and didn't go back up.

I can't envision what you mean. Sorry. I'd need a picture.

But as an aside, here is a link to a page I did (megawd) back in 1996 or so.

Even with that picture I can't tell what's going on.

It's part of a book I got in England of strange motorcycle engines. I must find the book again. There were some very unconventional ideas.

Bare with me, please. Increasing compression is the current approach to gaining efficiency with petrol. Before the better alloys and microprocessors were available, high compression was not cost effective. Breaking parts was common, as was unmanageable heat. Detonation was a terrible problem for ordinary running It is no problem at high RPMs because the speed of burning gas doesn't overwhelm piston speed, but that is not ordinary driving.

12:1 (volume compression) is now manageable. Consider that the maximum compression ratio for this discussion. Now, I cannot understand what it means to get full compression within half the length of the cylinder. Mathematically it does not work out. Ratios. See where I was in thinking?

Ah, I found the other strange engine page thanks to some kind soul who archived stuff way back when.

See this one:

stranger than strange

I'll try to recover the bad images.

The pistons are driven (somehow) by the complex "torque tube" arrangement coming out to the driving gear. Concentric crankshfts.

Looks like it would generate all sorts of torque, and be really problematic.

Both are pretty cool, nevertheless. Thanks!

David A. Smith

I am talking about a fundamental alteration of the geometry (along the lines of yoru weird engines, no doubt). Not that it would be practical, but that it would "potentially" improve the energy you get from each power stroke, because "precise timing" would be less important.

It also adversely affected the NOx output, so it was another reason to avoid it... requires more "conditioning" of the exhaust. "8:1" was chosen not for peak output or mechanical failure reasons, but for minimum emissions. No doubt the lower compression also served to reduce the "iron" that had to be toted around to restrain / withstand the higher pressures.

Sorry I was not clear.

The geometry of the "four bar mechanism" that a standard piston engine is, has maximum power output for about 45 deg of stroke, near mid stroke in the cylinder. The balance of the stroke spends force in "bending iron", not so much in turning the crank. Think of your foot on the peddle of a bike... plenty of power when the crank axis is perpendicular, but not so much far from that position.

Now imagine a foot operated pump. Every inch of travel is directly converting applied pressure into fluid motion, then to "energy of position" in raising a weight.

I do, now. Sorry for my part in confusing you. Sorry I snapped at you.

David A. Smith

I should have added that I'm talking about Before Nolead Gas. Fifties, and old cars in the Sixties.

FWIW, I don't drive much and when I do it's a 1958 VW Bug that I've modified, or a hand-build car with a highly modified VW T1 engine that is remarkably effective: 2165cc on a big block, big heads, 10:1 compression, custom pistons, machined from billet aluminum cylinders with nickelsil lining (means no liner, just a flash of plating), electronic ignition, split cam, four short carburetors, efficient gearing... translates to 45mpg and usually better on the highway, and all with a power/weight ratio that makes it very quick. But it's been parked now for four years. I got tired of the motor-heads who pestered me with questions and wanting to race.

(I've fixed the page:

Diesel tuners have been using propane for this purpose for some time. Combining this kind of recovery system, or propane injection with an Elsbett engine may solve some of the coking issues associated with SVO/ PPO combustion.

There is a new RFD for a group sci.energy.biofuel.engr. If ya'll are interested please review the RFD and post to news.groups.proposals.

Thanks in advance!