Does somebody take posts off of this newsgroup if they don't like them?

Thanks, Don. The incandescent light bulb is also 100% efficient. It is also an electricity to heat converter. The lack of efficiency is in the human eyesight being limited to a narrow band of electromagnetic wavelengths.

Our home is heated with heat pump and backed up with electric furnace. Any incandescent light turned on contributes 100% to the home heating. The down side is it also contributes when we don't need the heat!

When I try to explain all this to a tree hugger, their eyes just glaze over. Can't be true because their leader says it's not.

Paul

You're thinking about this in the same terms I was, and I still think it's the honest way to approach it. But as several people mentioned here, you could claim to save energy costs with one of these things if you use it for local room heating, and lower your general household temperature.

Not having seen the ads it isn't clear if they're including that fact, or if they're implying that they're talking about lowering costs for heating the whole house. The way the FTC interprets the law, if you imply something that isn't true, even without stating it explicitly, your ad is fraudulent.

-- Ed Huntress

You still belong to aarp even after they jumped in to the middle on the part "D" discussion and helped to scam us again?

They're nothing but an insurance company protecting the overblown salaries of the executives.

dennis in nca

To paraphrase an old time advice columnist "Eat it, it's like penicillin." ;)

dennis in nca

Theoretically, only YOU can cancel a newsgroup post on an unmoderated group. But, anyone who knows how to spoof an outgoing address can cancel your post, by pretending to be you. (I think you would get a "your post was cancelled" message.)

More likely, however, is that your post was "dropped". Usenet (NNTP) is a network of cooperating servers that pass along messages on a time-available basis. If they get too busy to handle incoming traffic, they just toss the overflow. As usenet is not a big moneymaker for general ISPs, they often don't allow enough network bandwidth or CPU time for it. It seems only the dedicated news servers take it seriously.

Jon

Right on, Don ! Even more eficient than (incandescent) electric lights. Did you ever wonder why light bulbs are rated in Watts ? AFAIK, there is no conversion from Watts to lumens.

Exactly. All electric heaters are virtually 100% efficient. It is easy to turn electricity into heat, very hard to turn it into anything else without some of the electric energy coming out as heat. Those heaters are a scam. I am trying to convince people of this, but the usual response is, "if it were not true, they wouldn't let them put that in the paper."

Don sez: "I saw your post, Pete. 'Course, I'm not very far from you. "

You yankees are laying a bad rap on our Amish friends. Down here we use one of the Eden heaters for spot cooling in the Summer months.

Bob Swinney

---- snipage ------

I agree with all of this thread. After AARP got into the Medicare part D "pig Pile", I Iost all respect for the organizatioin. It does little good to cancel ones membership. Some times motels offer a AARP discount that is greater than the AAA discount.

Regarding the Amish stove, thier TV advertising characterizes it as a

The Amish cabinetry aspect is bewildering -- the Luddite tendency of this sect is perhaps compatible with the low tech heat-illusion-box concept.

Farky Bipski

you ever wonder why

That part is true - Resistance electric heat when viewed all by itself in a vacuum is pretty efficient.

But the problem is the INefficiency inherent in generating the electricity and getting it from the power plant to your house. Heat losses in firing the boiler, and turning the generator, and running the cooling tower and all the auxilliaries.

If you are getting "Cheap" electricity from geothermal, or solar, or hydroelectric, or pumped storage hydroelectric you still have to build and maintain and operate the plants.

Then you have transformer losses at several points as you boost the voltage up for long distance transmission, and all the resistive and corona leakage losses along the transmission lines. And then transforming the voltage back down in several steps for distribution, till the customer sees it as 120/240V. And you PAY FOR every bit of that inefficiency as part of the power bill.

If you burn natural gas in a furnace in your basement to get heat, you get at least twice as much actual heat (if not three times) than you would if you burned the same quantity of natural gas in a powerplant boiler half a state away, and an electric heater element in the same heating system.

(You do a bit better running a Heat Pump in a mild climate, but not much - and only in mild climates. When it gets below about 45-F outside the efficiency falls off and by 35-F you have to switch to resistance heat. The outside evaporator core ices over.)

And you have to pay for the cost of running the powerplant and building the power lines on top of paying for the gas they used.

-->--

And for those who post and read using Google, there is a *long* fuse (often several hours) between a posting being made and it showing up on the Google newsreader -- even though it fairly quickly makes its way out to the rest of the world, and often followups are seen before your own post.

This has resulted in people re-trying multiple times because they thought that their articles had just vanished.

:-)

Note that each news server not only has its own expire times for articles, but the news administrator can tune it to be longer for some newsgroups and shorter for others (most often the most active ones). Thus, all the discussion about politics probably has the effect of getting shorter expire times on the news servers which don't pride themselves on keeping lots of articles. I know that when I ran a news server I had expire times set between 1 day and 30 days, depending on my personal interest in the newsgroups in question.

Try a different news server. Or talk to your current one and explain that rec.crafts.metalworking is of interest to you and could the please stretch the expire time a bit.

Some -- but most have gasoline or diesel powered backup generators.

Get a good news server and things are a lot better.

Enjoy, DoN.

Thanks, DoN. We've discussed these issues before when I asked why my RCM messages were purged (Oct, maybe and again in Dec without mention).

I've had these same issues with small local ISPs getting news feeds from the big ones, and with larger ISPs, with Terranews, and now with Forte. I'm beyond giving a crap why these problems exist.. if I miss something I might catch it the next time the subject comes up.

Very few things piss me off faster than software-related problems on idiotic machines, and it's not worth the frustration to me. Or, I'm the idiot, but it still doesn't matter enough for me to try this, then that, etc, etc.

I wasn't online over last weekend, and I didn't miss much of anything, certainly nothing metalworking-related (I checked).

When I got back, I just needed to delete a few more messages than I usually do on a daily basis.

The most reliable daily use service/software I use is Yahoo mail. Free, with huge bandwidth allotment and not a single problem. The few times that they've made changes in the past several/maybe 5 years, it actually got easier to use, and the bandwidth has been increased. It doesn't need to update for a half hour every day, and it only rarely displays a slight hiccup which gets corrected with a click of Back or Refresh. When I saw that MSoft was trying to buy Yahoo, it about made me sick.

I have a machine at work with a 5Kva transformer to turn 480 into 120v to run an assembly station. I'm used to seeing tranformers run hot but this thing, running only a small plc rack and a pc with monitor is doing 68C at this time of the year. It runs a torque gun also but I'm speaking of idle temperature with the gun not in use.

Input voltage is right, output correct. Ammeter was at home so I didn't get current values but, visually, there isn't that much load based on what is in the cabinet.

Thanks,

Wes

-- "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -- PJ O'Rourke

I'm using forte's feed which Easynews supplies. Lately, it takes an hour for posts to shop up at my end and google seems to get it in a few minutes. I miss supernews.

Wes

-- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

Um... 5000 BTUs/hr = 1464 watts.

That's never been the case.

There are mechanisms to "cancel" messages.

Some cancel spam. Some are abusive and cancle messages for spite.

Each NNTP provider makes decisions about what to do with them.

On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 03:46:07 -0500, the infamous Wes scrawled the following:

I'm using APN, too, but haven't noticed any delays. I just checked this morning posts and the last one I made was 27 minutes ago and it was already showing when I checked it just now. I got really mad at the delays and busy servers at Teranews so I pay for Forte's service. I'm really happy and $3/mo isn't bad at all for excellent service. I got 3 more months free when I upgraded to Agent v5.

-- Even with the best of maps and instruments, we can never fully chart our journeys. -- Gail Pool

Take the amp-clamp and compare it - preferably against an identical assembly station that isn't running hot.

I'll bet there's a defect in the transformer like shorted turns, or something funky with the laminations, and the energy being lost is turned into heat. Look at the output voltages and currents at idle and under moderate load, they should be balkanced if it's a 120X240V secondary.

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Ooops, sorry about that.