SF Broadway-Limited 4-8-4

Is the paint job on this model correct or did Broadway-Limited take a short cut and only half paint the model?
The engine itself is an oily or grimy black, but the driving wheels appear to be unpainted jet black plastic.
The tender is also oily or grimy black, but the under frame which includes the steps at the four corners and the rear end sill also appear to be unpainted jet black plastic.
I find other things annoying but not as much as the above. The headlight does not stay into the smoke box front causing light to leak out between the headlight casting and the smoke box. Why no engineer and fireman in the cab (yes I can easily add them) of this $300 locomotive when $100 locomotives can afford to include them.
I have remapped the outputs to the function keys that I want and had no problems with the unit operating. I dislike the fact that I cannot map the bell to the same function key as my Soundtraxx locos. Soundtraxx does not allow the whistle/horn to be mapped any higher than F2 while Quantum does not allow the Bell any higher than F3. Since my Soundtraxx units have the whistle at F2, This leaves F0,1,3 for the 3 lighting outputs on my other decoders. These outputs also cannot be set higher than F3. This makes be set the Soundtraxx bell to F4 (or higher) but the Quantum bell cannot be set to F4(or higher)
Stuart Sabatini Palm Coast,FL

So far everyone has missed the most glaring defect. What is a Westinghouse cross-compound air pump doing under the fireman's side of the cab?

Buy a cheap piece of junk and you get junk, no matter how expensive it is. I suspect that the air pump under the cab is supposed to be a coal screw engine. I haven't seen the model but that much for a plastic model is silly when you can get a more accurately modeled brass model for about the same price.
-- Bob May Losing weight is easy! If you ever want to lose weight, eat and drink less. Works every time it is tried!

PEACHCREEK wrote:
> So far everyone has missed the most glaring defect. What is a > Westinghouse cross-compound air pump doing under the fireman's side > of the cab?
Perhaps it is meant to be a representation of the stoker motor?
But, as an interesting footnote, there was a class of 2-8-2s belonging to the MoPac that DID have their air compressors underneath the cab...

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Why would an oil-fired 4-8-4 need a stoker motor? :-)

Sean S wrote:
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A fair question. I didn't realise the model was of 3751 in it's rebuilt form. It was delivered as a coal burner, along with it's thirteen classmates.
Photos and text in Worley's massive "Iron Horses of the Santa Fe Trail" confirm that one of the air compressors was eventually mounted under the cab.
(I should have looked at the book before posting!)

Mark Newton wrote:
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Me Too! I guess it helps prove there's a prototype for anything.
Though my comments on the ill-defined detail on this model still stand.
Dan Mitchell =========

Mark Newton wrote:
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That's a common location for the stoker engine, but it is normally mounted horizontally, cylinder heads facing (out) to the left side of the loco, and fairly tight up under the floor of the cab (to give the fireman a good shaking every time it turns on).
In Broadway's case, the cross compound air compressor is mounted vertically (as usual), but about where the fireman's injector usually goes. Really DUMB!
They also have the two (shielded) air compressors up on the front deck area where they belong.
This whole loco (AT&SF 4-8--4) is very poorly done. The boiler detail is coarse and ill defined. Kind'a like 'shapeless lump no. 7, 'shapeless lump no. 8, etc. The old Bachmann Plus model has a better shell.
The new PRR J-1 that just came out looks NICE in comparison. These Broadway locos have to be coming from different factories in China. Some are really nice, like the T-1, AC, and GG-1, while others are 'middle of the road' like the M-1, A, and J-1, and USRA 'Mike'. The AT&SF 4-8-4 is the worst one yet. They are all over the place on quality and detail/accuracy. They're starting to look more like the Bachmann of a few years back (but Bachmann has been getting steadily better ever since).
Dan Mitchell =========

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IIRC, the Bachmann Plus model was supposed to represent the 2900 class Northerns, which carried much of the same specs as the 5011 class 2-10-4's (above the frame). From what I can recall from Worley's book (which is on loan to a family member), the 3751 class Northerns are smaller than the 2900's, so there should be significant differences between the BLI and Botchmann models.

Sean S wrote:
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That may well be true. I was comparing the molding quality of the two shells, not their appropriateness for a particular loco. I won't again (and shouldn't have in the first place, as I've already proven) comment on the ACCURACY of the model.
And that's still a strange place for an air pump! :-( ... I've only seen similar on very small locos, narrow gauge ones, in the sub 20 ton sizes.
Still, as I've stated, I stand corrected on this loco's air pump location.
Dan Mitchell =========

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coarse and ill defined. Kind'a like 'shapeless lump no. 7, 'shapeless lump no. 8, etc. The old Bachmann Plus model has a better shell.<
One of the problems is the paint. It's so thick that it's adds probably 30/40 thousands to all the detail. If these engines could be stripped and repainted with a quality model paint I'm sure they would look better (one could also add lost wax casting for some of the detail). That said the detail is coarse but not horrible. I'd really like to see the shell without paint to make a fair comment. Also we have a pricing factor here, you want brass you pay the price of brass. The Bachmann shell molds were done years ago with all the pricing baggage that carries. I paid less than $255 for mine and for that money today with sound it's one hell of an engine. When I get an idea of what the 2-10-2s are going to look like I will order at least two, maybe more!

Jon Miller wrote:
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Yes, but some of BLI's other shells are very nicely done. The paint surely does not help, either, but that's the only cause of the 'mushy' detail on this model. Look at the superheater access hatch clamps, washout plugs, etc. And, considering the built in DCC and sound, it may well be a reasonable price ... though their own better-done models are their own competition here. The PRR M-1 suffered from some of the same problems, but not to this degree. My real point was the variation in quality from one of BLI's models to the next.
Dan Mitchell =========

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Westinghouse
And here I thought it was the OSHA foot massager....
Jim Stewart

Broadway Limited will be attending the Timonium Great Scale Train show next weekend. I'm sure most of their models will be on display. These folks put out a wonderful product and are quite eager to talk about them and field comments. I most definitely would recommend stopping by their booth. I'm a brass guy, but I find myself operating many of their locomotives. Check out our site www.gsmts.com for show details. Best... HZ Howard Zane 5236 Thunder Hill Road Columbia, MD 21045 410-730-1036
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Jim Stewart wrote:
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Oh Really? (© Fox Spews) I thought it was Fireman Rush Limbaugh's Oxycontin dispenser.
-- Steve Caple

Now that brought a chuckle and then a screen cleaner.... :)
Jim Stewart wrote:
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Oh Really? (© Fox Spews) I thought it was Fireman Rush Limbaugh's Oxycontin dispenser.

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Pictures of the real 3751 seem to indicate there's some sort of air or feedwater heater pump in that very location.

snipped-for-privacy@aol.combatspam (Sean S) wrote in (PEACHCREEK)
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Aw! Now why would you go and inject reality into what might have become a good flame war? Want to take any bets on the number of people who totally ignore your post and keep right on arguing the matter?

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Flame War? Who said anything about a flame war? I suspect that a cross compound air pump looks like a feedwater heater on a dark night at three hundred paces in a heavy rain, but for anyone who knows a little about steam locos it is a serious error. I will admit that there are fewer and fewer people who know a bit about steam locos, but I would hope that the manufacturers would know the difference. After all, it is supposed to be scale model, or is it a toy?

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steam
Does this photo help or confuse? http://www.gazette9.com/racing66/xt484.jpg
CTucker NY