Lister CS hybrid, parts needed

Hi guys,
I just picked up a basket case of lister CS 3/1 parts, as I'm
going through it, I was wondering about building this engine as a 5/1.
It seems only the head, oil pump and injector are different. Is this an
option ? I don't have money to spend on 3/1 parts, but if anyone has
some bits going, I may still be interested. I don't intend to show this
engine, other than to my friends and family, but would like it to be of
use in my workshop. The major faults seem to be cylinder head, this one
is frost damaged, and having now got the crankshaft out, one bearing is
seized, opposite the gear side of the crankshaft. What are the bearing
bushes made out of, would it be feasible to make a two part bush, rather
than press it over the rusted, pitted part of the shaft. This and lots
more questions to come... As someone else pointed out (Peter) I could
end up with some really pretty garden flywheel ornaments.
Thanks Peter...
Joules, the oily one
Reply to
Joules
Loading thread data ...
Here's a picture of my new, errr baby!!!
formatting link
Any suggestions, offers of help, or even public ridicule welcome 8-)
Joules
Reply to
Joules
Right, ridicule where shall I begin.
You could have at least hidden the modern genny from view, it puts the lister to shame with its bright paint.
Sorry best I can do, Next!
Martin P
Joules wrote:
Reply to
Campingstoveman
Looks pretty good to me. The mains are the split type which means you can split the housings to remove the crank. Is the head really beyond stitching or JB? hth Roland
Reply to
Roland Craven
LOL the genny can go when I have a beautifull Lister CS providing power... On the cylinder block, its been bodged and it looks like car filler. Having wiped the gundge out of the cylinder, I seem to be missing some chrome linear...Hmmm, me thinks that the piston came to a sudden stop, then got freed. This is looking more like a 5/1 conversion. I also found some nasty marks on the crankshaft journal, could these be polished and left???
formatting link
Or require more drastic measures...
Joules
Reply to
Joules
If you can lightly polish the journal you may get away with it, you could try a high melt solder to fill the pits and then polish otherwise more expense and new big end and grind.
Martin P
Joules wrote:
formatting link
Reply to
Campingstoveman
I gather from that it maybe worth looking for another crankshaft, if one passes by, so to speak.
Joules
Reply to
Joules
You got the crank out then :-) Rust. Like Martin I'd say its marginal. If the thrust side (not shown in pic) is sound and the journal measures round you may get away with a polish. Pits on the non-thrust side will simply hold oil and I wouldn't bother trying to fill em. Whatever you put in carries the risk of it coming unstuck :-( Does the engine have a solid whitemetal big end or steel-backed shells?? regards Roland
formatting link
>
Reply to
Roland Craven
The other side of the cranshaft is worse.
formatting link
Should I be able to tell if the big end bearing is solid or steel backed without taking the bearing apart. At a guess I would say solid... So it's probably steel backed LOL
Joules
Reply to
Joules
I'm with Roland. A strip of 1000 grit W&D paper with a little oil and a very minimal amount of work to take off any rusty protrusions, clean it all very thoroughly, mike it up for size & ovality & put it back together. These engines are well - and indeed, over - engineered & even doing useful work, I doubt if it is going to run all day every day under full load. Fit & forget with a clear conscience while you look around you for some spares on the basis that it might not see you out!
The frost damaged head - is it leaking around the filler repair? I've known such repairs last for years without giving any trouble at all and that on much more highly stressed car blocks. Clean dry surfaces are vital during repair, but it's not going to be under high pressure I take it?
If you are right about the bore, that might be Bad News as a flaking chrome bore cannot be fixed and will be likely to continue flaking during use. Careful cleaning might bring the pleasant surprise that its just caked on shite.
My overall view would be that as it was (I take it) a cheap engine, I'd try to get it back together and running as cheaply as possible without any restoration above that required to actually make it go. Running it for a few dozen hours will tell you whether or not it's worth opening your wallet further.
Regards,
J. Kim Siddorn,
Reply to
Kim Siddorn
Thanks for that Kim, yep I paid a real good price for the engine bits!!! a couple of beer tokens and an hour or so of pleasant chatting...
The chrome is shot as I can get my finger nail into the cracks both at the top of the cylinder and the bottom. I could try making a split sleeve on my lathe and use that to guage, scrape the journal surface in an attempt to get it smooth(I use that term roughly) and even.
I updated the journal picture showing the damage in more detail.
formatting link
And this is the state of the linear, the chrome is flaking off at the top, and down the cylinder is a small area missing... Wonder if this has anything to do with the siezed bearing and journal damage ???
formatting link

Joules
Reply to
Joules
I expect so, it all looks like rust damage to me
Cheers Tim
Dutton Dry-Dock Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs Vintage diesel engine service
Reply to
Tim Leech
I was unable to update the phot of the journal, so had to post another image...
formatting link
This shows more clearly the damage, I still wonder if the high spots would scrape down, the bearing in the conrod is pretty scored so can't use that to blue and check fit, though it's probably worth a try.
Joules
Reply to
Joules
Yes, the cylinder is history I'm afraid, its just going to keep shedding bits of chrome from now on :-( Of course years ago you could get them bored and rechromed. Your best bet in this case may well be to convert to a 5/1, as bits/basket case engines are not exactly uncommon for these, whreas 3/1's are decidedly thin on the ground.
I also found some nasty marks on the crankshaft journal, could these
Kim's suggestion is one I would go along with here. Of course you may get lucky and find another crank along with the cylinder barrel.....
Regards
Philip T-E
formatting link
Reply to
philipte
Looking at your most recent photo of the journal, it looks to me like it has been like this for a long time & has been run like that.
The bore is indeed history, but there is no reason why you cannot get it bored & fit a piston with rings designed to run in cast iron bore. Most engines don't have benefit of chrome liner & last for years.
A Listard bore is one of those great-while-its- going ideas!
Regards,
J. Kim Siddorn,
Reply to
Kim Siddorn
I think the problem is going to be one of finding an O/S piston, and also of removing the chrome layer. ISTR that when cylinders went for reconditioning the old chrome was stripped electrolytically.
Regards
Philip T-E
Reply to
ClaraNET
Kim you hit the nail on the head. I just removes the piston from it's rod. The cir clips had rusted to nothing, bar enough to stop the pin being removed. Some brute force split them and they came out, the little end bearing is in great shape. Piston required some de-coking, and some rust spots flattening, it then slid into the old cylinder with no problems. I post a picture of the big end bearings, having expected to find some nasties embedded in them, or severe gauling, I was happy to find pretty reasonable surfaces, and upon offering up the lower bearing sleeve to the crankshaft could find no tight or gritty spots... Things looking up, almost, I broke two rings getting them off...
formatting link
Joules
Reply to
Joules
If the piston's OK you could consider getting the liner bored out & sleeved to standard. Best to draw it out first & see how much corrosion there is on the water side, to make sure there's enough metal there to bore it.
HTH Tim
Dutton Dry-Dock Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs Vintage diesel engine service
Reply to
Tim Leech
Joules,
David Harris may be able to provide you with CS piston rings. See SEM Helpline for Lister.
They'll be much cheaper than from other sources.
Regards, Arthur G
been like this for a long time & has
bored & fit a piston with rings designed to
for years.
The cir clips had rusted to nothing, bar
came out, the little end bearing is in
it then slid into the old cylinder with
find some nasties embedded in them, or
offering up the lower bearing sleeve to the
broke two rings getting them off...
formatting link
Reply to
Arthur G
I'm now open to suggestions for freeing the seized bearing on the crankshaft. My thoughts at the momment are, fit a jubilee clip to the bearing shell, apply heat and then wrench the bearing round, if it will. Other plan, machine flats on it and use big spanner, final resort cut the bearing in two, and think about making a two part bearing...
Joules
Reply to
Joules

PolyTech Forum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.