Locks or Religion? Bob DeWeese, CML

I'm not of Bob's religious persuasion - but I have been around usenet for a (very) long time. There is a "dispensation" :-) given to posters. They are allowed to put a small unrelated item at the bottom of their post (often called a ".sig") Some people put a joke, or a slogan, or a philosophical statement - often a quote from something they like. IMHO, a biblical quotation falls in this same category.

So while I don't ask Bob to put in this material, I respect his right to end his post with material of his choosing. (There are some "nettiquette" ground rules concerning size, offensiveness, etc. - but here I'm just discussing the topic of this material.)

General nettiquette is that as long as the body of the note is mostly on topic and the signature is brief and not _actively_ offensive, the post is fine.

If a given participant's style bothers you that much, you may want to learn to use the killfile features of your newsreader. In this case I think you'd be foolish to do so since Bob's a darned good resource and worth listening to, but it's your choice. (There are a few people here whom I've partially killfiled -- I don't see their posts unless I actively select them -- to keep myself from getting sucked into an irrelevant argument with them; I can ususally tell from other folks' responses whether I ought to read any given note. And there are some threads I suppress no matter who's involved, for much the same reason: if I keep reading I'm going to say something I'll regret.)

Sorry, but I am offended and find it rude and in poor taste. Not to keep repeating myself, but I am here to read about locksmithing. I am sure Bob is a nice guy, a good locksmith and has contributed much info to this group. However, if I am interested in reading a post about a lock related subject, why do I have to read about how I should humble myself for the lord, or how I should be saved. I also noticed StorminMormon says at the end of his post, "learn more about jeseus" with a link to his web site. I don't find Norman's to be offensive. He is giving you a choice. If you want to learn more, go to his website. He is not quoting scriptures from his beliefs, but Bob is. Why doesn't Bob and any one else that doesn't find this to be offensive start a news group dedicated to born again locksmiths. This way then can solve lock related problems and quote bible verses all day long, without offending anyone.

All the quotes I see of his are after the reason for his post. Wears his religion on his sleave though. Yes, he's obviously guilty of that. What an awful, offensive thing! Stone him NOW!! <sarcasm;-)> Why are you looking so hard for something to be offended about? The bits I added to your header hit close to home? Too many folks any more seem to look for any reason to be offended. Most of them are members of the Godless, gutless, gunless, appeasing left. <PLONK> Don't know what that means? Pull out fifty cents, it would probably buy you a better brain.

David H. "Shooting someone with a dirty pistol Is a dirty shame and an insult to boot. Shootin' 'em is OK if they deserve it, but you don't have to be insulting too". Paul D., USMC, beloved uncle, rip

well I know how one person out there treats something he considers spam....

-SNIP-

snipped-for-privacy@whateverISP.com

'Key

No if only people could realize that everyone is different and accept that some people like things that others do not...

Oh... And to those of you out there who think that anyone owns newsgroups -- that new anti-spam law only applies to e-mail addresses that a subsriber pays for or those on "private" domains...

Newsgroups are neither... They are beyond any one ISPs control... Some decide to filter messages better than others...

To each their own...

Evan the maintenance man

Tim, its simple.. just dont read the sig area of the posts. That is what I do. I simply just ignore them. I see the ASCII Ribbon, bible quotes, learn more about jesus sig's, and I simply choose not to read them cause I am personally not interested in that. I dont whine and complain about it, simply ignore it..

See post above "Re: Help dial has fallen off, "email me privately I'll tell you how to get it open" CML after his name and he offers free info to an obvious non locksmith which will screw a real locksmith out of revenue? This guy may be good at passing tests but he has all the good common sense God gave an animal cracker. The obvious obviously never occurs to him.

David H. Fire Arms Instructor for the great right wing conspiracy.

For that matter, I'm gonna block this thread.

My experience is a bit different. I found Yahoo! groups before I found USenet. And I sorta "grew up" with the footers typical of what I just put at the bottom. So, for me, Bob's signature box isn't offensive. Actually, I hardly notice it. Just a question of tuning it out. Sorry it irritates you, Tim. I know there's a lot on the net (and particularly usenet / newsgroups) that irritates me.

One of my biggest pet peeves (and I'm doing it now, with apologies) is when several messages later, the text is totally different than the subject header of the message. Seems few people revise the subject line as the conversation winds and twists through time.

The sharing of information is the purpose of newsgroups. And any time someone does another person a favor, that person is "screwing a real [whatever] out of revenue". Offer someone a lift and you're screwing a real taxi driver out of revenue. Tell someone how to fix a computer and you're screwing a real consultant out of revenue. Give CPR and you might just screw a real mortician out of revenue. Are we to assume by your attitude that "real locksmiths" must also be "real jerks" who will never offer a bit of help or advice to a stranger because someone, somewhere might charge the stranger money for the same help or advice? What goes around tends to come around. Pay it forward. The obvious obviously never occurs to you.

Stop reading into this for more than what it is. I'm not looking for something to complain about or be offended about. I have a very content life and seldom complain about anything. I can ignore the .sig at the bottom of the post, as Steve suggested. That is not my point. I was just annoyed that everytime I read one of Bob's posts there has to be bible quotes attached to it. If Bob is religous, fine, so be it. I don't care to hear about HIS personal beliefs HERE. I resent the recruitment. I feel that this forum is not the place for it. Maybe at the next locksmith meeting I'll bring my bible and we can sing some hymns together before reading the minutes from last months meeting. Or better still, the next time I go to church, I'll bring some locksmith buddies and we can sit in the back and talk shop, while evryone is trying to pray. There is a time and place for everything. Why should I have to read about the lord when I am here to read about locks? It is two different subjects that don't belong in the same forum. Obviously some, not all of you, who have posted follow ups to my message are too ignorant to understand my point. I have survived in this business for many years without this news group. I thought by joining this group, it would be nice to share knowledge and help other people around the country in my trade. However, if I have to be reminded about the lord, or being saved, or if I'm going to hell, while reading about locks, then I'll pass. You'll have to excuse me now, I have some more kittens to kill. God Bless.

"David H" snipped-for-privacy@ev1.netnospam wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@corp.supernews.com>...

Okay, you're offended. That's why in the US we need the 1st amendment which guarantees freedom of speech. That means (in theory) I can express opions that may be offensive to others without censure. I've always been amused that today that means that pronographers and pedophiles get freedoms that aren't extended to those that prefer to express their thoughts and opinions by prayer and uplifting thought provoking philosophy.

Okay, the point you are making is time and place and the appropriateness in the venue. Bob has shown he is a knowledgable locksmith. He hasn't prosolyted, only shown a portion of his personality and values. How can that be offensive? It's who he is. He's real. I prefer that to something else.

I say, if something offends but doesn't harm you - get over it and post on topic like he does. Put anything you want in you're tag line, then allow folks the same freedom you took to say they find it offensive

If it's locks and locksmithing you want to talk about, by all means do so. In any usenet you have to extract what you want and let a lot of other things go by.

I can think of many worse things than a Bible quote. Would you make the same issue if it were out of a penthouse fourm, or would that just be freedom of speech?

Mike Thomas Lock & Key For an email list discussion of locksmith related marketing concepts join us:

It's my sig file. It's in every email I send. And BTW - It's not "Bible verse_s_" It's the same one.

See above

They are not in the body of the post. See above. What is *in* the post _is_ on topic.

Gee. You get offended easily. Not to get "relgious" here, but _you_ brought it up. Jesus Christ has been offending (some) people for 2000 years. If He or His words in my sig file offend you, then don't click on my posts. Pretty simple.

No.

Bob

Funny, I hadn't even noticed it until someone brought it up..... Go figure.

Leon Rowell

Bob DeWeese, CML wrote:

Is the above your personal belief?

-snip-

It's a posting signature. There is nothing wrong with putting it there irregardless of where he's posting.