Does anyone else do this?

Can't help with an explanation of the logic and rationale, or lack thereof, but if (you don't say) you're looking for a way out; create a feature (any feat; datum, annotation, etc.) and drag it above the last generated feature. Now drag the last generated feature above the newly created feature. You can now drag the Insert point above the newly created feature and go about your business.

Yeah, I do that several times a day :~P

I certainly understand the need for an occasional vent. An appropriate subject line would have prevented my wasting time trying to be helpful, though, when a simple "Yeah, sucks don't it?" was the desired response.

I'm missing something. Why aren't you able to use the Fix Model method to begin building the new feature on-the-spot?

That said, I agree that suppressed features and insert mode are a problem.

Dave

No, I've never done that, don't think I even knew clip/suppress does as you say. I just go into the Dreaded Resolve Mode and fix the feature failure, including, as Geesaman suggested, using Fix Model (for features that need fixing before the failed one because they caused the current feature to fail). I guess I'm also left with questions, such as why you'd ignore the built in "insert" (Resolve Mode) and try to do that by the back door (suppressing a bunch of features, then trying to ignore and make a big end run around them). All I can think is that this is something you learned a long time ago and have been beating your head against the wall ever since. You might reconsider doing it this way, bite the bullet and learn to use Resolve Mode (other than clip/suppress).

The only reason I can think of for using clip/suppress is to quickly get out of the DRM so you can reload the part and start to figure out what went wrong. If you're using Intralink, you can reload the part easily by doing 'File>Update>Current' and it restores the file to the last saved version. If you wanted to learn resolve feature failures, I'm sure I saw webcast specifically on that topic at PTC.com

David Janes

Scoff, harrrumph. Ok. I see. I've tried that in the past: Fix Model .Feature ..Confirm ...Insert Mode shows Insert Mode Menu Manager with available choices of

Cancel and Return. No Activate.

The reason there is no Activate is because I am working with Insert Mode Activated when the feature failure occurs. The 'trick' is to Cancel Insert Mode. The model tries to regen and cycles back to Resolve Mode and THEN I can, once more Fix Model, Feature, ...

I don't dread Resolve Mode. Very rarely do I meet with frustration after ... Clip Suppress, take a break, come back and sort it out. Is that what you mean by 'back door'? ;^)

We don't always get the desired response from others. Your problem is how to live in such a nasty world.

The main reason is that I want to stop and retrieve an older version of the file so I can have a good look at the failed feature. I can also save it at this point so the work I have done since the previous regen is not lost. Calling a backup model on the fly is okay on occasion, but I get a bit antsy knowing everything that's changed is in session and not on the hard drive. ProE even crashes without warning sometimes!

Often for me working on a file is a process of grinding through an existing model (because the designer wants to make some changes to the appearance, size, etc) going feature by feature to update it. I'd rather save along the way.

You're right Dave, I could do this, and it's habit that makes me do it the way I do. When the feature fails, if I:

#Fix Model #Feature #Confirm #Insert Mode #Activate then pick the last feature before the failed one I am then where I want to be and I can save it at that point if I want.

Of course it's a lot more menu picks this way. If I could just drag that arrow up the tree....

I think I will make this one of those enhancement requests.

You're right Dave, I could do this, and it's habit that makes me do it the way I do. When the feature fails, if I:

#Fix Model #Feature #Confirm #Insert Mode #Activate then pick the last feature before the failed one I am then where I want to be and I can save it at that point if I want.

Of course it's a lot more menu picks this way. If I could just drag that arrow up the tree....

I think I will make this one of those enhancement requests.

__________________________________________

Would "Roll Model" (before failed feature) do what you want? However, the most frequent repair scenario I've come across involves simpler stuff than Fix Model, for example, Quick Fix>Redefine or Replace references (investigating with a backup model usually helps with figuring out what references need to be replaced). If that worked then no need for clip/suppress and no need to slide the Insert bar up through dozens or hundreds of suppressed features. Talk about tedious and time consuming! just try to get that bar to slide when your destination requires the bar to scroll above the last visible feature, hopping up one feature at a time. Or you do the scroll bar and drag some more, scroll bar, drag some more, etc. Think I'll pass on this "easy" way.

David Janes

one has to think of a situation where a complex model needs maintenance that was created by someone else or long time ago... every now & then essential features fail to regen with only slightly varied dimensions!

The best way to handle this is with two parallel sessions of Pro/E, one of them read only. I prefer to change the background color to RED, so I always know which one I work on and which one is for analysis.

This method is even better with two seats/monitors side by side :-), so it is easy to identify faulty features in the "still-alive" model using their ID no and the model tree - kind of forensic CAD surgery, e. g. when its about to repair difficult "use quilt" features.

Walther

Model Tree Items Display; clear the Suppressed Objects tick box.

A person such as myself reading this discussion might get the impression that there's something inherently 'bad' about Clip Suppress or slovenly about anyone that would us it. If that is so would someone please make that case.

On a parallel, re: "slide the Insert bar up through dozens or hundreds of suppressed features"; I don't often work with a Model Tree longer than a page or two in length having Grouped features solely for the purpose of keeping it short, use them as 'volatile' structures, Grouping and Ungrouping to shift relevant and irrelevant to task at hand features into view. Doesn't everyone?

Yes, I've done it this way too. I have two monitors too so it's useful. I also change the background color, in fact I have several mapkeys converted to menu icons that change the syscol. I use one to change it to white whenever I need to print a shaded view or save a jpeg. I have another to change it to the old blue if I'm feeling nostalgic, plus a couple of gray shaded backgrounds.

I group things too, but sometimes it's a pain because if one of the features in the group fails, then the whole group fails. I also dislike sliding the Insert bar up the tree if it's more than a page because you have to hold it up above the top of the tree and watch the tree scroll up and let go of the button at just the right time.

I group things too, but sometimes it's a pain because if one of the features in the group fails, then the whole group fails. __________________

This might be a different subject in assemblies where I also use groups a lot. The behavior is certainly different. There you can have the group regenerate, but have all the components in the group frozen, no indication unless you run Model Check. However, using the Search tool, search on Component and select Frozen on the Status page will find all those components for you.

David Janes

And this gets the OP's "Insert" bar where he needs it?

Not "bad", just a seemingly eleborate work around to no apparent advantage over the tools designed for the job. The only advantage mentioned was scrolling an insert bar vs a couple menu picks (typically automated with a map key). Again, the advantage seemed illusory.

Groups are inherently volatile if only because of the lack of functionality for maintaining them. While you can drag/add a feature to a group, you can't remove features. So ungrouping and reconstituting the group is normal. But, you're right, it's a very handy way of organizing and maintaining the model tree, making it more obvious what's going on (as long as you rename meaningfully) and reducing it's length. In fact, it's a fairly common practice of mine to get the end of a modelling session and to start dragging features around, specifically to make them easier to group. The other great advantage of groups is that you can pattern them.

David Janes

I don't see any Clear Advantage either way. I do think that those without training and / or without pre-Wildfire experience (me on both counts) will be biased toward using Clip Suppress, for good or bad, until they learn to get over the panic attack (a conditioned reaction if you come up from the low end) associate with a feature failure and get familiar with Resolve Mode Menu Manager. For practical purposes it doesn't (?, therefore I ask) make a hill of beans difference which way you go with the exception of the Grouped feature that fails; you gotta go Menu Manager that way either to resolve the issue or Ungroup Failed if you opted to Suppress.

Of course you can, albeit with some minor caveats. That may have been new to WF2.

And Unpattern them. Comes in handy sometimes.

Resolve mode has been around for a very long time, at least 10 years.

Like I said, the advantage for me is that I can stop and save my file at that point before I go forward to resolve. There's nothing more infuriating than resolving half a dozen failed features in a row then ProE goes "Boom" and you have to start again.

I did this recently, it worked really well. I have to say Wildfire's handling of patterns is way better than it used to be.

Yeah, there is that. Have had it happen. To go off on a tangent again, does regen backup have a roll to play in this? I know I've seen the term but if I ever learned anything about it it's been lost.