Rifling machine plans

Anyone got a site or place where there are plans or drawings that show something like a sine bar machine or other style that wouldn't be that
hard to build?
Am thinking of building a flintlock or percussion rifle all from scratch.
--
Steve W.

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wrote:

See http://orro.net/2011/02/rifling-machine/ for some ideas.
--
cheers,

John B.
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typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

    Once I figured out what he was doing, I saw how clever that method is. And adaptable, as in "one can easily change the twist, without having to make a new guide."     The fun part is that now I have an idea for how to put spiral 'carvings' on wooden banister post. Now all I need is the lathe, and the space to set up. Oh, and a banister which needs posts. B-)
--
pyotr filipivich
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Here's the lathe you need: http://ornamentalturning.co.uk/
A Rose Engine can create extremely complex geometric patterns like on the back of a $1 bill.
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On 23/10/2019 10:58, Steve W. wrote:

An interesting question, I remember when I grew up in the US in the 1970s seeing a film several times of a working museum, in
Kentucky?, and the main detail was about the rifling technique and
produce the master screw which governed the rifling cutter.
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The slow, tedious, manual method of gun making prompted several early inventors to create automation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Blanchard_ (inventor)
Until around 1850 military contracts provided the only advance financing and guaranteed demand to support buying new production machinery. Combined with chronic labor shortages as immigrants headed for the frontier, government rifle purchases were the first driver for America's rapid advances in industrial automation. In 1800 we were a backward third world nation, by the 1850's we were selling world-class rifle production machines to Britain. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Precision_Museum
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On 24/10/2019 02:44, Jim Wilkins wrote:

Similarly in England at the Portmouth blocks mills https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portsmouth_Block_Mills .

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The ideas underlying the Industrial Revolution were originally French, but England and then America provided more productive environments for their development. AFAICT automation was suppressed elsewhere to protect traditional jobs but that may not be the whole answer.
An engineer from India who resented the USA and Europe's domination of the modern world asked me why Europe had suddenly surged ahead of everyone else, particularly India and China, and I couldn't fully answer him.
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On Friday, October 25, 2019 at 12:52:31 PM UTC-7, Jim Wilkins wrote:

One theory: the black death resulted in younger property owners, who could foresee a long life ahead, and weren't inclined to be staid and conservative. So, they innovated.
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typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

    Younger property owners had no more expectation of a long life during the plague years than those they inherited the property from. "Eat, drink, and make Merry, tomorrow we die."     A more likely theory: loss of work force allowed/required innovation. You needed more efficient technologies, you couldn't just add more manpower. And, there were fewer "old hands" to say that's not how we've done it."
    On a side note, the Roman Empire had the technology to make steam engines. But there was no demand, in large part because those who could afford the expense of the machines, saw no need. They could always buy more manpower.
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pyotr filipivich
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on Mon, 4 Nov 2019 11:36:59 -0800 (PST)

It's claimed that Anthemius, the architect of Hagia Sophia in Istanbul, did build an steam-powered device of some sort, possibly an unbalanced engine. http://wiki.vintagemachinery.org/The-History-of-the-Steam-Engine-1890.ashx
Although Savery's engine of 1698 used steam under pressure, the problem of making a strong boiler wasn't solved for another hundred years.
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https://dailyhistory.org/How_did_Petrarch_influence_the_Renaissance%3F https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerolamo_Cardano
However, great minds in Persia, India and China did not spark similar advances. https://www.britannica.com/biography/al-Khwarizmi
I wonder if the difference was cultural attitudes to change.
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typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

    Bingo. It is interesting to note that much of the scientific development of The West (specifically England,) was done by Dissenters, those who were not part of the Established Church. Likewise the early Golden Age of the Muslim world had as much to do with non-muslim scholars, and a desire by Muslim potentates to "show off." But that changed in the 12th (??) Century with a judgment that what we would call "science" was not compatible with Islam.
    It has also been said that one issue which helped hold China back was the Mandate of Heaven. If the Emperor said "do it" it got done. If he said "nope" - it didn't happen. I'm thinking of the expeditions which reached to Madagascar(iirc), but were ended "suddenly", the ships left to rot on the beach.
    But it is a puzzlement.

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pyotr filipivich
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My personal, unproven opinion is that a critical element is social acceptance of successful and influential people working with their own hands at home. A British expat racing engineer who lives in Spain told me they don't understand at all why he would buy machine tools and materials to make suspension parts etc at home, it Just Isn't Done. Fortunately Brits are allowed, even expected, to be eccentric.
https://www.popularwoodworking.com/chris-schwarz-blog/woodworking-abroad-common-or-a-curiosity/ "Wll, here in Mexico, woodworking as a hobby is practically non existent, mostly because of cultural and as mention economic reasons. Most woodworking here is done by carpenters, and it is viewed a a trade practiced by not very educated people. It used to be that hiring a carpenter was so cheap that well to do people would rather do that than be seen with a hammer in hand."
Brazil: "Some societies have historically considered manual labor to be demeaning, in the sense of indicating lower social status. At the extreme, manual labor in those societies was assigned the people of lowest status-slaves. Those who have had the social prestige as well as the political power and economic wherewithal to change those cultural norms, the descendants of the masters, have had little incentive to do so."
This mirrors my experience in Germany: "On the economy" means outside the self-contained American society of the military bases, where most troops stayed. I was very much the exception, exploring the towns and countryside as much as possible. "From Glenn's post, it sounds like little has changed since I lived and worked wood in Germany. I bought most of my wood through the on-post craft shop because all I could find on the economy was roughsawn blue spruce (that was in the 80's). My German friends, those who worked with their hands anyway, were mostly into working on thier cars and motorcycles. The only woodworkers I met were pros."
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typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

    There are a whole lot of cultural reasons, as you point out. The difference between the Aristocracy and "Trade" goes way back. And while his Lordship might take up woodturning as a hobby, it was not something "serious". This was prevalent even in the late 1800s: the British boffins would discover a means to make an artificial fibre, dye, "thing", but it would be the Germans who created an industry. Research and the pursuit of Science was a noble thing. Making money from it was just so, so, well, it just wasn't seemly.     Which is why so many British aristocratic family had American daughters in law. With the bride came the money to keep the family estates.
    Anyway, this still doesn't explain how so many Englishmen got wealthy "in trade" making steel, coal, cloth, etc, etc, and other parts of the world didn't. "Culture" explains some of it, but that is a very large tent.     The question comes: why did (the English especially) Western Europe get not just the "science" but the technological advances? Starting with gun-powder. The Chinese had it, but firearms never became "big".
--
pyotr filipivich
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on Mon, 4 Nov 2019

A good starting point is why the French failed to develop so many of their numerous inventions. The word "sabotage" (wrecking machinery with heavy wooden shoes, Sabots) comes to mind.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luddite "...eventually the movement was suppressed with legal and military force."
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on Mon, 4 Nov 2019

https://www.learnchinesehistory.com/chinese-cannons-history/
"Xena" showed pretty good examples of that Chinese artillery, although they couldn't resist adding in an apparent nuke.
Western guns (gonnes) were similarly crude in that era and didn't fit the ethic of the heroic knight.
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typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

    But, once they got the major kinks worked out, musketeers were easier to train than archers. "Quaintly has its own quality."
    I remember James Burke in his series "Connections" point out that after the Burgundian wars in the mid 15th C, the Swiss pike formation revolutionized warfare, because a pike formation could stop Knights, for a whole lot less.     Later, as the handgonnes got more reliable, the "bayonet" was invented, allowing you to outfit a "combined arms" (guns and pikes) for less. Etc, etc.
--
pyotr filipivich
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on Mon, 4 Nov 2019

And still don't. How often do you see foreign complaints that some common (to us) item is too heavily taxed to import and not made locally?
https://shieldgeo.com/5-countries-where-its-harder-to-start-a-business/
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-0400 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

    There are many reasons, some specious, some plausible.
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