JC, TRA and the future of rocketry

Yes, I'm aware that there is a vague legal distinction between amateur rocketry (IE, non-professional) and "amateur" rocketry (making motors). I also think it's an unnecessarily confusing term with which to make this distinction, which is largely unknown to the general populace or even most authorities.

"Slipping past" implies some form of dishonesty. Are you seriously suggesting that someone is telling the insurance, regulators etc that EX motors are certified commercial motors?? Or is it simply that YOU think the two should be totally and completely separated, so you're slinging a little mud at those who disagree?

Jerry has refused to do as you suggest, although, almost verbatim, it was suggested to him some time ago. Hell, I have always liked his motors; once upon a time I flew lots of them, won't touch them now as they can't be legally shipped in commerce. TRA and Nar certification, who cares, I sure don't. On the other hand, receiving Jerry's illegally shipped class 1 hazmat via UPS, USPS, or other common carrier, not worth it. However, listening to Jerry or his mouth pieces weasel around and flame me, priceless. (;-)

Fred

Ismaeel Abdur-Rasheed wrote:

No there isn't. Amateur INCLUDES making motors or not.

HPR dis-includes making motors.

MR dis-includes making motors.

Of course!

Jerry

No it would have been more accurqate if YOU said jerry's subcontractors make kickbutt propellant.

What HE said was correct. I make kick butt motors :)

I hope you can justify this libel and trade libel in light of:

Pot! From your own site:

Especially intriguing considering the following:

Here we go again Jerry: deception, fraudulent deception etc. etc. I stand behind what I said and you have quoted. You haven't the balls to take me or anyone on rec. to court for "libel and or trade libel". Please, please, please pretty please, let me be the first.... Better yet, pick a motor, any US Rockets motor up through, let's say a K reloadable, preferable a fast load; bill me for it, ship it to me, via what you believe to be a common carrier, that you can legally use to ship. When I receive the shipment, I'll verify the legality of the shipment with DOT. If it's a clean shipment, I will publish the fact on RMR, ROL and any other list you so desire, and in addition, I'll pay double for the motor. Come on Jerry, lets see if we can make something relevant out of what has got to be the longest running spinning wheel thread in RMR history. (;-)

Jerry Irv> >

So unlike TRA it *IS* possible to see the FULL POLICY. Hmmm.

Some people understand the role of a fiduciary. Be glad to train Brucie. I bet he has not been trusted with millions of dollars under management.

Jerry

You know the ordering process.

Use it.

I offered to send you a crate of 19 98mm M loads. You said if I could ship legally, I said I would then you changed your mind. Make good on your offer.

Jerry

I am curious. What does this element entail. Exactly?

Jerry

I have no use for 19 M motors, then or now, you made the offer and I never excepted. However one K motor I can use now.... The current offer is on the table and if you got the balls, take me up on it. You know I like your motors, what have you got to lose??? Either your legal or your not, prove it and do a little dance, take a little chance. You can consider this a "public ordering process", in front of all your friends and folks who know you and I on RMR. Come on, what have you got to loose.

Shipping address; W. E . Fred Wallace

Fred

Jerry Irv> >

There is no "public ordering process".

There is an ordering process where by you properly identify yourself. If you do not want to identify yourself you are free to buy from errortech or one of their dealers and supply a LEUP despite 27 CFR 555.141-a-8 and receive that abuse if you so desire.

Do a little dance, take a little chance.

The offer stands, take it or leave it. Improvise, adapt, and overcome. As for as who I am, you know good and well who I am. You sure as hell didn't have any trouble wanting to ship before. You just tell me what need?? Copy of my DL, LEUP, etc. You need to get ready to fish or cut bait....

BTW, from your US Rockets ordering web page:

MOTORS OR CUSTOM CHECKLIST: Please note that due to NEW abusive government regulations added WITHOUT legal process we are not shipping motors until they pull their head out

of their *** and return our civil rights to us, or

we force it out of them through litigation. Yes we

are pissed. And rightfully so. 30 years of cooperation and THIS is what we get in return.

So what is your process for ordering and shipping motors???

Fred

Jerry Irv> >

Blackhawk R&D wrote:

BTW, I meant to post this also.. it's for john cato , for cato only.

Bill Davenport

TRA insurance may currently covers EX. It didn't back then. And it NEVER covered uncertified commercial motors, such as the ones that were fraudulently declared certified by TRA TMT.

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!

When TRA first created the term "EX" that is EXACTLY what they were doing. Slipping home made motors past insurance, site owners, FAA, and everyone else as if they were HPR.

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!

now come clean, Jerry

I've heard rumors that you have a special incantation you say over the propellant that makes it kick ass! ;o)

- iz

Jerry Irv> The manufacturer is the guy who collects a group of subcontractors and

oh, that's cold ... that's cold

- iz

badbill wrote:

I do but only people who cannot wear "I don't make propellant with Jerry Irvine" t-shirts know what it is.

Jerry