Low Power Estes Slow Motion Launch Vids

Dave Grayvis wrote:

Punch cards? Punch cards? We don't want no stinkin' punch cards!
Paper tape, please....
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Kevin Trojanowski wrote:

Well, a paper tape drive would make playing mp3 files a whole lot less labor intensive. But I don't know, are they reliable?
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Dave Grayvis wrote:

Well, they don't sell 'em from Claremont.... 8-}
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Gotta wonder how many poll workers in Florida are named Chad.
Randy www.vernarockets.com
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Dan Cox wrote:

You've never heard of jpeg, javascript, or html buffer overrun exploits, I assume?
Those virus DO exist. In fact, a new one just appeared a few weeks ago, exploiting an unpatched flaw in Internet Explorer.
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John Bowles wrote:

Heres the top 10 list from the University of Arizona's Chemical Engineering Dept. http://www.che.arizona.edu/intranet/virus.htm
Top 10 viruses in November 2005 1 W32/Sober-Z - How it spreads Email attachments 2 W32/Netsky-P - How it spreads Email attachments 3 W32/Mytob-GH - How it spreads Email attachments 4 W32/Mytob-EX - Variant of above. 5 W32/Zafi-D - How it spreads Email attachments 6 W32/Mytob-BE Variant of above. 7 W32/Zafi-B-Variant of above. 8 W32/Mytob-AS Variant of above. 9 W32/Netsky-D Variant of above. 10 W32/Mytob-C Variant of above.
You can also go here: http://www.sophos.com/virusinfo / http://www.sophos.com/virusinfo/topten / If you read their white papers section you'll see it concentrates on email worms and spyware/adware - meaning executable programs that you got probably with something like Bonzi Buddy(in the old days), kazaa, AIM, WeatherDesktop etc or that you downloaded seperately for whatever bizarre reason.
Prove me wrong, show me a virus that requires no user interaction, I'll read up on it and either agree or disagree that it's real and I'll also state how much of a threat I think it is to the average Joe. Every buffer bug I've ever seen was either a hoax or you had to have such perfect conditions for it to work that it would most likely never effect very many people. Whenever you hear about a mass virus outbreak, it is always an email virus. You may read about buffer overflow bugs on various tech news sites but if you dig deep and really read up on it you'll generally find that it's next to impossible for it to really work. Some of these things you really have to work at it to spread.
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Dan Cox wrote:

I never said they were a major threat - but there is a big diffrence between "They are not a major threat." and "They don't exist."
The ones I have seen require you to visit a malicous website, whereupon the malformed data exploits a flaw in the browser or plugin and begins to execute code on your computer - with no other user interaction aside from visiting the website. Now, its not a big stretch of the imagination to see hybrid email/web viruses - many people (perhaps outnumbered by those that don't, sadly, but its slowly spreading) know not to open attachments now. But how many people know not to click the link in the "joke" their friend just sent them?
Now, as far as one in existance, here's some from the last several weeks, though it appears Microsoft just patched this one, finally.
http://secunia.com/advisories/15546 /
And heres another one, that was recently fixed by google blocking the exploit (though the bug was in IE):
http://www.hacker.co.il/security/ie/css_import.html
Now, these have been patched (And we all know users always update windows, right?), but they did exist in the wild for a time without patches. Its foolish to think it can't happen again.
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John Bowles wrote:

Thanks for responding John. Both of these are really exploits(Albeit mischievious ones) and not viruses themselves. The first issue(which could DELIVER a virus) apparently has 5 methods of attack. The first two are really just 'dumb pet tricks' in that they trick the user into accepting a file download dialog, and granted, that's a cruel joke but it's nothing particularly exotic. The third issue isn't likely to bug anyone. The fourth and fifth are interesting, although reference is made to tricking the user into visiting a malicious webpage. I don't know what the trick is, they didn't specify what it said or how it worked but the end result was code execution of some variety in MS's com objects. Note that this is one of those many bugs that hasn't actually been perpetrated in the real world. It was only discovered by security folks actively trying to find these things. Most virus writers aren't this clever but more importantly there is a much less likelyhood of success with obscure hacks such as this. There's a reason the biggest, most widespread viruses use email and downloadable executables,, because they are the simplest to guarantee successful execution. Hell everyone wants to see 'XYZ' naked right? Just Click Here!
The second item isn't a virus either. It's just another exploit that requires a certain string of events to occur. It does not propogate anything. It requires the user to have performed a series of steps, namely visiting a site that loads another site within it and then traps the user's data as it is displayed or entered. That's not a virus, it's a devious gimmick designed to steal information but it's not something that will get picked up on by the Anti Virus scanning software. It's a bug and requires specialized knowledge to make it function.
However: The first exploit 'sounds' like it could install a virus on your system but I suspect it cannot deliver much in terms of payload size. Meaning that it can't do much even if it did execute something. Once you're infected it can go no farther unless it tries to use outlook to send out emails to other users which brings us back to that the email issue again. It would probably provide links in those emails so that people would visit the same site. This is the sort of stuff that people really just don't encounter in their day to day lives. Yes I'll grant you that any number of things are possible, but the likelyhood of success is minimal and even more importantly the likelyhood of propagation is even less. There' just 'dumb pet tricks' if you get my meaning.
Perspective: Bird Flu is reported as being such a dangerous new contagious virus that's going to kill us all. Thing is only a handful of people have been killed by it over the last few years but yet AIDS has killed thousands in the same period of time, yet somehow bird flue is more dangerous than aids. Now granted, AIDS requires a different infection method but perhaps you understand what I mean. Anyone for instance could probably infect a very high percentage of broadband users simply by scanning broadband networks for network shares on users' harddrives. Many people share their entire C drive because it's easier to specifiy individual folder shares for their family members on their home network. You can use that to install any number of things. You could put a batch file in their startup folder to do a format C: > nul for instance. There are literally thousands and thousands(probably millions) of people who have shares open on their PC and have left themselves wideopen. Now if they're behind a firewall they're probably safe, except that they've possibly granted special access to another user on their home network to said shares who DOESN'T have a firewall running.
The point is that yes there are exploits, but there also a hell of a lot more ways to do mischief and in way that you're much more likely to encounter. One further line of rambling: My car has a recall notice for break problems in freezing snowy weather, oh no! What do I do!? Um, well nothing because I live in sunny, non snowy central california, meaning I probably won't ever encounter the problem involved in the recall. See what I mean?
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Dan Cox wrote:

Oh and by the way I use the Mozilla Suite myself and don't care much for IE or TiredSox for that matter. I recommend that other people also use Mozilla for browsing and email because they are somewhat less prone to the most common issues.
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wrote:
<huge whack>

Opera, and Eudora here...
Zonealarm Pro as an outbound firewall, and a hardware firewall inbound...
I've never had a single problem..
Ever.
<g>
tah
--
Tod A. Hilty
Hilty Information Systems
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snipped-for-privacy@weinerboy.org says...

Hmmm. Let me introduce you to my "little friend".
--
Tweak

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And that's exactly why in newer versions of AOL, links & images are disabled in email... unless the user CHOOSES to enable them.
Doug
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Their are 25 or more in the wild IE exploits that load Trojan code just by visiting a website.
I've seen it in action in the wild and in labs.
in less then 700ms, the zeno codes loads up a few horses.
heck , even "cool search" loads up this way.
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AlMax wrote:

Remember the "good 'ol days" when a few software vendors accidentally released software with viruses?
Nothing says it won't happen again....
-Kevin
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wrote:

I think you should report the scam being perpetrated by the entire computer industry to the US Attorney General or even the UN. Its a world wide scam!!!
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Phil Stein wrote:

Phil, there is a very profitable segment of the IT world which makes money by solving problems that don't necessarily exist or that are highly unlikely to affect any significant number of people. If you would rather live by a paranoid mindset then that's your choice. Someone however that has a little bit of technical knowledge and a little bit more common sense can get by just fine.
PS The TV doesn't send images of you back to Big Brother either ;)
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wrote:

I work with the 'profitable segment' of IT that you refer to. If you saw what people do to their computers with viruses & spyware, you wouldn;t make statements like that. The software serves a purpose.
Here's a concept you might want to contemplate - employee productivity.
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it does if you have a set top box. ive seen the data files sent back to the head end ;)
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AlMax wrote:

For those that didn't get the joke, he means the marketing data,, meaning what you watched when. :)
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;) I've written the code that sends the data files back to the head end.
--
Darren J Longhorn http://www.geocities.com/darrenlonghorn /
NSRG #005 http://www.northstarrocketry.org.uk /
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