Re: Bachmann innovations.

Apparently we already are. Well, that nice Mr. Blair seems to think he is, and surely if it's good enough for our King it should be good enough for the rest of us mere mortals . . . . .

I think you'll find he is hedging his bets - Britain another state of the EU or USA, and Blair the President of which ever !.....

It is the exception which proves the rule :o)

There are many more EM-gauge and P4 modellers than H0 modellers in the UK.

(kim)

No, you should remain New Zealanders with your own laws and customs and the British should continue to model in 4mm/ft.

I'm Dutch myelf but I fail to see why the British should become europeans just because people outside of europe can't tell the difference.

(kim)

Yes, of course there are, it's much easier to modify a proprietry offering than to build from scratch.

Greg.P.

Looking at the British H0 societyy website would not suggest thatr they are inclined to scratch building, they do funny things like slicing vans down the middle and fitting smaller wheels More seriously it seems to concentrate on rtr and kits, they just have an extremely limited choice compared to the cornucopia of 4mm.

The dedicated scratch builders go for S gauge or 2mm fine. Keith

Make friends in the hobby. Visit Garratt photos for the big steam lovers.

Hey, I represent that statement! >:^(

This dedicated scratch builder goes with HO! (and a little G)

Greg.P.

It is today, it wasn't in the past. EM and P4 were once the exclusive preserve of scratch builders. I suspect there are hard liners who would prefer it had stayed that way? Your statement "join the move the H0" implied there were a significant number of British outline H0 modellers and that this number was steadilly growing. If anything the proportion of British outline H0 enthusiasts has shrunk since the 1960's while those adopting fine scale 4mm have risen dramatically.

(kim)

Fleischman has probably sold more of it's Warships and Bullied coaches than there are fine scale modellers in the UK. ;-)

Regards, Greg.P.

"Gregory Procter" wrote

As you're someone from the other side of the world I'd be interested to know on what basis you make that claim? ;-)

John.

In message , Gregory Procter writes

Fleischmann don't make Bullied coaches, so they can't have sold any. However, they may make and Bulleid coaches.

I pulled it out of thin air! :-))))

Further: Let's say Fleischmann's minimum run was 2000 locos. They have two colour schemes times two completely separate designs of mechanisim. There have to have been at least 8000 locos manufactured and at least the first runs sold well enough to justify the retooling, so at the absolute minimum 4000 sold initially and another couple of thousand of the retooled model in addition.

There's 6000 models/modellers at the absolute minimum but probably far more. (I'm assuming these models have mostly sold to modellers outside Britain who want _a_ British train for their collections)

So what's your estimate of the number of UK fine scale modellers? The P4 society membership number would give us a starting point.

Regards, Greg.P.

Damn, I always have trouble with the "i" and "e" in Bullied (opps) Bulleid!

Regards, Greg.P.

"Gregory Procter" wrote

Not a clue, but the P4 Society are not the only one purporting to support finecale modelling - I think the EM Gauge Society would have something to say about that.

How about assuming that say half of the finescale modellers in the UK might buy 'Model Railway Journal'? Not much help though - I have no idea of their circulation.

John.

UK customers wouldn't buy etched brass RTR, it would have to be injection-moulded plastic or nothing. Getting financial backing for one just set of moulds would be difficult enough. Two sets would be almost impossible.

(kim)

So one locomotive (based on a German design) produced by one manufacturer over the last 35 years is evidence of "the move to H0"? If the Warship is so successful why has Fleischman not produced a second UK outline locomotive?

(kim)

The NMRA is irrelevant. KD have set the KD H0 height standard. The advantage to use this height for 00 on screw linked prototypes is you do not need to cut away the headstock.

The new KD 78 will work on sharper curves if you cut back the coupler box, and gives you enough length. See my web page if interested.

There was a smiley face after that sentence, but with the serious side that Fleischmann must have sold the first run quickly enough to retool the Warship chassis when they upgraded the V200 but not enough to do the SR MN that was hinted at to go with the Bulleid coaches.

I was aiming to stay somewhere near reality:

- Fleischmann was not into small production runs.(assumption: they must have do a reasonable sized initial run)

- They retooled the Warship chassis when they revised the V200 mechanisim. (assumption: they expected to sell a reasonable number of additional Warship models)

- The hinted at Merchant Navy has never appeared. (assumption: not enough Warships sold to justify the required investment of an all new loco.

- The Bulleid coaches have not been upgraded to NEM pockets where most other European models have. (assumption: either the earlier production run has sat in the warehouse for the last ten years or Fl. didn't see UK buyers wanting NEM pockets)

Greg.P.

I have my own coupler which I consider superior (NEM compatible) and a MkII designed for production if I can ever find a means to get it produced. (NEM compatible, close coupler compatible and about the size of the KD head)