Death nell of Nitro??

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A rechargeable battery that can be fully charged in just 6 minutes, lasts 10 times as long as today's rechargeables and can provide bursts of electricity up to three times more powerful is showing promise in a Nevada lab.

(Your title made me think that they had discovered that nitromethane caused cancer or something :)

Sounds good. Though they're not very clear which batteries it's being compared to -- it may very well last 10x as long as a NiCd (but even that would be impressive) and provide bursts of up to 3C (since many Li-ion cells aren't meant to be discharged at over 1C.)

I wouldn't count glow power out quite yet.

Reply to
Doug McLaren

I've spent the last year playing around with Lipos and brushless motors in the smaller more affordable sizes...basically the foamies. I had a blast and a lot of my gloe planes started collecting dust, then...I don't know how to explain it, but I just got a little bored of electric and wanted my glow planes back. I missed the sound, I missed the smell, I missed the larger size and better wind penetration, I just missed it in general. So now the roles have reversed. I'm sure I will fo back and forth. Glow's market share is going to take a hit, but it isn't going anywhere, that's my bet.

Reply to
FrankC29

Hmm, deja-vue all over again :-)

Anyone here remember the breakthrough aluminium based battery technology paraded in (IIRC) 1997 ? Whatever happened to that then ?

IME new battery technologies are announced every year but only one in ten or one in twenty ever make it into a shop.

Hopefully I'm wrong but...

Reply to
Boo

Main killer for electrics for me was the problem with each plane seeming to need a different battery. Two packs for each plane minimum. Spend the entire day before flight day charging up a pile of batteries unless you have about half a grand invested in chargers. I think I am down to 3 electric planes and generally only fly one of em on any given day at the field. Havent flown my Zagi in months. Will never get rid of my glow planes. Am having fun with my brushless Slow Stick tho...

Reply to
Fubar of The HillPeople
[The word is "knell"]

Yup. Over the past few months there have been press releases by a couple companies having to do with nanotech battery improvements.

Some look like they might be legit:

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and some are clearly 100% bullshit:

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Reply to
Grant Edwards

As you may know, I have been away for a couple of years, or close to it. I am astounded at the progress the electric models have made in my absence. I spent an entire afternoon going through Hobby Lobby International's collection of video clips of electric models. Very, very impressive. What truly amazed me was that the video of the Wingo I bought just before dropping out of R/C was still being shown as is. Neat.

I too was looking for something in an article that would say the sole nitro plant was closing, or something like that. Didn't find it.

I have flown glow powered models with just methanol and oil for fuel. It was no big deal. They flew just fine, but with less power. One could get used to it quite easily.

Ed Cregger

Reply to
Ed Cregger

I suspect you are right. I think that in the end, the electrics will attract more people initially, who will then switch to at least some glow flying later.

The RTF market is where the electrics can really shine.

Ed Cregger

Reply to
Ed Cregger

Ah. I have just three (LIPO) batteries at the moment for 6 planes in all.

The secret is adjusting gear ratios and prop sizes to match the pack to the model.

The only two areas they can't quite match glo are ultimate energy and power to weight - but they match for sport applications. Only if you want to fly for 24 hours, or do >140mph do you struggle, and cost.

Ther is a bit more to come in performance - the theoretical limuts should take batteries to where they can match glo on power, though probably never in duration - and a lot more to come on cost.

Of course they don't smell or sound the same, and I know peole still build steam boats too. :-)

One pack forseveral palnes. As many as you like. With flight tomes being around 1/2 hoyur or more, thats three ten minute flights and then try a differemny model.

Three packs will net you a total of an hour and a half, by which time the first pack is charged, so lets say abiout 2 hours total flying time...

...but since they are electric, I don't need to make an expedition of it. Down the local playground, fly for an hour, and back home.

Go LIPO young man, and throw all those other batteries away.

>
Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

After a year or two of glo planes I got meself a GWS Formosa with a brushless setup - it's a great flying plane, carves very nice patterns, does close to everything that my go planes can do and I can fly it at parks and sporting fields. The other week I saw a guy I call "Pattern King" doing his routine with a very nice balsa electric - his superb skills seemed to translate effortlessly to his electric model, and I can see this as an example of the future for non-foamie electrics. But all that said, I still enjoy cranking around the flying field with a screaming 2-stroke.

As Frank says, I'll probably do both for a while to come. As time goes on, electric flight times will increase, recharge times will reduce along with cost so you don't need 5 packs and 2 chargers to have a good morning's flying, but I suspect there'll be glo planes for quite a few years to come.

Reply to
Poxy

IMO even a 6 minute charge is about 5 times longer than refueling a glow engine. Then there is the lack of sound and the smell of nitro.

Reply to
Sport Pilot

True, but how much time do you spend chatting with others between flights? Often this is more than enough to recharge.

Reply to
C G

Often I refuel right away and go up again. But you are right about many flights. But the current 1/2 hour is unacceptable, and buying multiple battery packs is too expensive. Even then it wouldn't be the same.

Reply to
Sport Pilot

I don't caharge at all at the field,. I fly till teh packs are almost flat. Then go home.

They take less of my direct time to charge than wipeing the s**te off a glo model ever did.

And start instantly every time.

Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

If you'd stop flying from cow pastures, you might not have this problem :-)

Reply to
C G

No disagreement, it's one of the things that's kept me flying glow. I still remember when I used to race electric off road cars. Lots of time spent swapping packs, standing in front of the truck waiting for a pack to peak, etc. There's alot to be said for gas and go.

Reply to
C G

| IMO even a 6 minute charge is about 5 times longer than refueling a | glow engine.

To be fair, it probably takes me longer than 1.2 minutes to refill a glow engine. I don't usually treat it like a race.

And to give electrics their due, quite often when I fly my electrics and the (mostly glow) AMA field, I'll throw a spare battery in my pocket, walk out to the pilot station, check the plane out and throw. When done flying, I remove the old battery, put in pocket (hopefully it's not hot) and put the fresh battery in the plane, check the controls and motor, and throw. Total downtime is usually less than a minute, though it depends on how the battery is mounted.

With a glow plane, I'd have to pick up the plane, walk back to the pits, fuel it, hook up the glow ignitor, find the starter, apply the starter, check the mixture (since it's probably changed slightly, and a whole lot if this is the first flight of the day), run it up for a second or two to get any bubbles out of the line (from running it dry, if I did) then taxi back out or carry the plane back out ...

There's no denying it -- if you want your plane back in the air fast, electrics rule, as long as you have at least two battery packs. (Actually, gliders rule, especially slope gliders (winches and hi-starts still require some work.) But electrics still beat gas/glow powered planes.)

| Then there is the lack of sound and the smell of nitro.

Yes, and that's a large part of why electrics are so popular. Or was that not your point?

And as for the 6 minute charge, I'll believe it when I see it -- i.e. when I have it in my hot little hands. And I don't expect that this will be any time soon. And when/if they do arrive, I expect problems like low lifespans and high prices.

And once 6 minute charge batteries are here (if they ever are), that's going to require a lot of power. My XE2 (Zagi-like) has a 3 cell 2200 mAh LiPo pack. 6 minute charge = 10C charge rate, so I'd have to charge at 22 amps. That's quite a bit -- my field battery can't do that. My car battery can, but I'll have to add a special charge circuit, or go straight to the battery. And my current chargers can't do that -- not even all of them together can put out 22 amps. And this isn't a particularly large plane.

Reply to
Doug McLaren

The price for LiPos may be set to come down a couple of notches! ;^)

Reply to
Paul McIntosh

Yeah, I guess the slope soarers would be laughing at all of us...until their sloper ends up at the bottom of the hill and it's time for a hike.

Reply to
FrankC29

I made an estimate, but I belive an electric pump takes about a minute.

I wouldnt dare put a battery pack in my pocket. I have seen battery packs that shorted, in fact one model burned because of this.

I only use a starter when the engine is stubborn, which is fairly rare.

gas/glow

You seem to neglect the time to swap the battery pack, this was a pita on one model I had, though it should be fairly simple on most.

I like the noise. It tells me if evey thing is working. If the electric battery is low, I don't know it till it slows down or loses altitude. I can compensate right away with glow. Besides I like hearing the sound and smell of glow engines. I even enjoy mounting them on a test stand and starting them up.

Yeah, but eventually that will be solved.

that's

Hot batterys and burned models will be a problem.

Reply to
Sport Pilot

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