union legislature, in machine shops?

you're a good boy, you deserve a nice pat on the head from your master

I wouldn't bother to keep my vote secret. I'd explain it clearly in my letter of resignation.

KG

threr's far too much selfishness in our system though- at least in america patriotism means something, in canada it just means you've been conned.

100% on that.

How's that going to happen in a union shop? In all the shops I've worked for (all non-union except for one which I left shorty after it organized then went bankrupt and out of business) the cream of the crop has always risen to the top. The last thing I need is union card carrying slugs holding me down. No thanks.

It's not just about wages- do one job or another, you'll still get paid, maybe more maybe less: I think it is far more important to ensure worker safety and not having to fear reprisal or your boss having a bad day combined with a personality disorder. A union does not necessarily level wages for all workers- I think people here are conviently equating unions with equal wages for all

Exactly. Except I don't work in union shops and I prefer to tell people who would try to organize my co-workers, that'd be simpletons like you, to go piss up a rope and keep the job I enjoy.

This is typical union scare mongering.

Fuck off.

Yup.

If you don't want to work in a union shop then find employment elsewhere.

Pretty much a no-brainer...

It's not just about wages- do one job or another, you'll still get paid, maybe more maybe less: I think it is far more important to ensure worker safety

***** OSHA *****

and not having to fear reprisal or your boss having a bad day combined with a personality disorder.

***** American civil lawsuit *****

A union does not necessarily level wages for all workers- I think people here are conviently equating unions with equal wages for all

***** I think people here are equating unions with control. The thing is...we don't need unions these days. Unions created by pissed off people is one thing...unions created by unions is insane. All I gotta say is every single union shop around here pays like crap. Funny when Bush put in an order for tons of B-52's, Lockheed down the road threw out an add for 20 grade A machinists...starting pay in the newspaper was 16.25 an hr. It didn't say "you can get from 16.25", it said clearly 16.25 no matter what you know or what you can do. There is no barganing allowed to happen because of the unions.

Lockheed in west central florida is a low skilled workhouse that sucks up tax money to survive. Building Americas Military.

Nice.

not fear mongering at all; happened to a friend of mine, only cnc guy in the shop, worked excessive hours steady over 2 years, then one day he caught the boss fooling around with the receptionist- a week later he was fired for a fictional cause.

I don't give a flying f*ck what anyone does with their business. Or didn't untill my tax dollars started being used for bailouts, but that's something else.

Stupid f*ck should have kept his big mouth shut.

What's excessive hours anyway? I've been working 60-70 hours a week for months with no end to it yet in sight. The overtime comes in kind of handy you know, I was able to buy my wife a brand new car for valentines day because of it.

Actually I dont care a single whit whether or not workers organize.

What I do care about is where corporate management caves in to unreasonabe demands from a union....all the while continuing to milk the company dry with excessive bonuses for themselves then blaming the union when the place finally does go t*ts--IOW with the short term "seek and destroy" management creed that is so commonplace these days I'd say the place you left was in all likelyhood on an unavoidable collision course anyways.

adding another layer of boss's.

Tom

I don't see it. Enlighten me.

Sorry, same thing...

Different money trail is all--see even without a gov bail-out a failed company's suppliers and get fleeced, if they survive have to raise prices and so on....in the long run the money still ends up trickling basically upwards then directly into the same fat cat non-producer asshole leecher pockets.

And all this talk about employers and "just rewards for risk taking" is pure horseshit.....if you want to take risks then go to vegas, careful and conservative business planning and execution still ultimately wins long term everytime even though far too often we promote failure by rewarding those who caused it in order for to obtain personal profit for themselves.

Fundamentally different here is that in the case of organized labor, there is no profit to the members in running a company into the dirt.

never said a thing- he told me about it afterwards- the boss was just paranoid

- but really, he should have signed the union card when it came around before all that.

I've worked 70-80 hours for years at a time. Never got a penny of overtime or additional vacation or such.

Typically, after a long stint - a trip to a customer in Europe or Asia and stay for a month with the new machine designed for him.

For some of us, it was a way of life. We got awards and thanks and sales.

The hardest time I had was coming to work Friday 7:00 am as normal - and not going home till 3pm Monday. The vending machines were almost empty and the two of us managed to bug out for an hour to take a shower, meet and eat breakfast at a fast breakfast place and then back for the customer visit. Customer was a personal friend of both of us and the demo wasn't going to fail in spite of some managers. The VP knew what we were doing as he kept talking to the guard. Kept him awake!

Mart> snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote: