I'm Stuck: Auto Lock Problem (With URL for Pics!)

Read the can Bob, WD-40 claim to fame is that it coats metal parts and replaces any water. It not difficult to figure that locks with moving parts and tight tolerences will eventually become immovable when enough of the residual WD-40 coats parts beyond their fits. It doesn't take a CML to read the can and realise that any non-coating pure lubricant is better for a lock. Maybe you'll get it worked out in the next 23 years and read about the products you use and recommend. NO WD-40 is not a lubricant....... it is a Water Dislacement...... Even graphite in small doses would be better than WD-40. Use WD-40 on your boat motors........ And no apparently you don't know what works because you're the type that doesn't learn from simple concepts like recommended uses as prescribed by the manufacturers. I can provide you with several products that you can use instead of WD-40 that will do the job better and more effectively................... but let me guess??? You're not interested........... Old dogs new tricks syndrome.

The problem with this logic is that if you were to spray an assembly with WD-40 the solvent in the new spray would disolve any residue from the previous spray.
It doesn't take a CML to read What lubricant is non-coating?
Maybe you'll get it worked out in the next 23 years and read about the The dictionary provides the definition
Main Entry: lu·bri·cant Pronunciation: 'lü-bri-k&nt Function: noun 1 : a substance (as grease) capable of reducing friction, heat, and wear when introduced as a film between solid surfaces 2 : something that lessens or prevents friction or difficulty ============================================
So tell me, if WD-40 is sprayed on to a latch that is sticking and it stops sticking, is it your contention that the only explanation is that the water that was displaced? Or could it be that perhaps WD-40 is a lubricant?
If you look at a can of WD-40 it says it lubricates. Are they misrepresenting the properties of their product? If so, how is it that with their famous blue can in almost every household in America and folks spraying it on all sorts of squeaks that if in fact it did not lubricate, why do the squeaks stop?
Even graphite in small doses would be better than If you are trying to make the point that WD-40 might not be the most effective lubricant, I will grant you that. If however you contend that it is not a lubricant, or that it "... has ruined more locks than any other form of known abuse" I would suggest that you have one or more threaded fasteners that are inadequately tightened.

Why then does WD-40 use the catch phrase "For whatever you've got that sticks or squeaks"?
Yes I know that WD stands for water displacement. I've read the can. I've also read the box of Q-Tips that tells me not to stick one in my ear.
I got one for you...
My father's neighbor swore by WD-40 for his arthritis (sp?). So do tens of thousands of other people. It doesn't say "for arthritis relief" on the can but for some reason on some people it works. Those people don't know why and don't care. It works. That's good enough for them.
I know I've had good luck with WD-40 over the years in locks. You can say anything you want about it or me, but it doesn't change the fact that it works.
BTW - How long have you been a locksmith? My guess is you're not. I'm guessing you are an engineer or some other by-the-book occupation who knows better and more than everyone else, on every subject. Am I close?.

"Bob DeWeese, CML" wrote in message:
My guess is that he is an engineer of some kind... All about facts on paper and theoretical stuff, but lacking real world life experience in many things... I mean did you see what he was ranting on about in the "Fat Wallet Glen" thread...
Whatever line of work he is in he doesn't understand the concept of 'on-call' labor... I am just an employee of a property management company, but if Iget called in to work outside of my normal working hours I get paid double my normal hourly pay rate... Oh and if I am only there for 20 mintues, I get paid for three hours worth of work for the trouble of coming in... Such concepts of how the world works are very foreign to a 9-5 day shift type employee in a non-service industry...
WD-40 is a big part of my life as a Maintenance Man... It gets used everywhere and on just about everything... I will note however that it is not recommended in certain types of locks with sidebar locking mechanisms... It won't destroy them if used on the lock (it is just not what the lock manufacturer recommends), but WD-40 evaporates rather quickly compared to other types of lubricant... I never use graphite on anything... It is a royal pain in the butt if you spill it...
I did ask "nice2cu" to use his actual name, and explain his qualifications as he did claim once in that other thread to be a locksmith... Maybe he will sometime here in this thread... Who knows...
Evan the Maintenance Man

A good trick with these of any other screw which will take a relatively limited amount of torque before stripping is to place a punch or other object about the same size as the screw head in contact with it and give it a sharp blow or two with a hammer. Don't hit the screw directly with the hammer you may damage the part the tool needs to contact. You can also gently tap the tool, whatever it may be, in place to be sure it's seated well. A little extra time here can save a big headache if you strip it out.

If the lock won't turn back to the lock position then it's probably the shifter but if the lock plug is in the lock position and the key still won't come out it's a problem with the cylinder assembly.

I remember once Theresa (my wife) put Armor-All on the rubber step inside the sliding door on my van - to "make it look nice".... and didn't warn me. Armor-All is definitely not a lubricant, but I would have argued that point with anyone that day as I was picking myself up out of the back of the van. :)
The look on my face (from what I've been told) was priceless.

Thanks. I might try this, but I am worried that if I did that I might damage the lock cylinder so that I would not be able to start the car again (by ruining a pin??). If this is a possibility, I would like to have a new cylinder available to replace it. Or, if it actually were damaged, I probably could just pull the lock cylinder, and then use a screwdriver to turn the ignition switch, which I actually replaced 4 years ago. I hope that would work to at least get the car started.

I'll have to see how the cables run, to see if I can adjust that mechanism. For the record, I made sure the automatic transmission was in "Park", which it was. And I also tried turning the steering wheel to both extremes, to see if this would help, but it didn't. I tried wiggling the ignition cylinder; and also tried turning the steering wheel while turning the key from "Lock" to "On", all with no luck.
I am able to turn the key from "Lock" to "On" and to "Start" smoothly and vice-versa. However, I cannot turn it to "Accessory", which is actually on the other side of "Lock", not on the side where "On" and "Start" are.

Will do so. It's difficult to see, since the plastic/rubber window molding gets in the way. But maybe with the help of a light.
yes, thank you. it actually was an older key, factory original. I did have a lot of weight on the key ring though, about 20 other keys. Mmaybe this might have contributed to the problem.

excellent advice Bob! I had actually let me AAA coverage lapse. So I will renew, and next time just call them. The locksmiths in my area charge $75 for an auto lockout, but I should have just paid that. I realize you guys have to make a living too :) , and when I called for the quote, it was at around 10 PM. I am pretty mechanically inclined (I have done things like my own tie-rod ends and rear shocks and brakes), so I think it's just a matter of being able to get in there somehow and knowing what to look for!

Thanks Bob! Here are two pics:
As you can see, it's raining. It's supposed to rain for the next three days. Ugh. Hopefully, it will clear for a few hours in the next few days, so I can fix it. Otherwise, I will have to wait until Tuesday.

Excellent! I actually posted a pic of this on the url I posted in a post above:
It appears there are three Torx bolts. Fortunately, I have Torx sockets to use, and even an impact wrench if need be.
With these screws removed you should be able to twist the ok, this might be easier than drilling through rivets of the seat belt retainer brace! :) I'll give this a try as soon as the rain here stops.

the thing is the outside and inside door handles work fine. It's only the outside lock cylinder that will not unlock or lock the lock. But the inside door lock works fine. The loose rod I found is attached to the back of the lock cylinder (I can see it through a hole on the inside of the door). I just need to find where the loose rod connects and how, which I will do as soon as I can get access! :)
I agree. I have lots of loose screws and bolts lying around now, although it should be fairly obvious to me where they go. I just hope I can fit everyhting back the way it should be fitted. And the bolts for one of the seat belt brace that I took off had either Loc-tite or RTV gasket sealer or thread sealer or something like that on them though. I'm not sure if re-applying whatever that is is necessary though.
yep, it is definitely in the "off/lock" position. I can't turn it counter-clockwise to "accessory", which is where that is on this car. And I know it's "off", since I can't turn the radio on. If I want to play the radio now without the engine running, I have to turn the key to "on".

I'm curious. How would doing this help? Would it knock out any dirt, so you could get a better grip with the Torx bit socket?
You can also gently tap the tool, whatever it thank you. this is good advice, and i will be careful. I'm hoping that if I have trouble, a quick burst using my impact wrench would work. I would have to use it with a 1/2" to 3/8" adapter, since my Torx bit sockets are 3/8" I think.

Over the years I have tried just about everything on the market. Now I only use two spray lubes, INOX (Australian made) & WD 40. Remember brass on brass within a 'quality' lock cylinder is basically self lubricating, but when a pollutant such as dust or road grime enter the equation then you need to wash it out, hence WD 40. I've never had a problem with WD 40 leaving behind a gummy film etc. INOX is better for latches and mechanical linkages, springs etc as it is a true lube and lasts for years without gumming up or washing off. I think in fact that if you believe that WD 40 causes untold lock problems, that YOU in fact are from the OLD SCHOOL that believes everything they hear without first hand tryal & error experience. And just as a side note, WD 40 is terrific on sore joints and arthritis, FACT. Cheers.

Okay, my original idea won't work. I've since read here (if I'm not mistaken) that the linkage is disconnected at the latch unit, not the cylinder (where the key goes). was going to suggest an easy way to pull that cyl but now it's a mute point.
The only thing left to do at this point is to drill out the rivets on the seatbelt rollers. (Everyone I ever did had bolts. Never saw one with rivets until now)
***Make sure you replace them with factory rivets. Your life could depend on those rivets one day.*** Or... suppose you could bolt them back in.
Good luck.

I had actually let me AAA coverage lapse. So I will Let me make another suggestion. AAA contracts with the cheapest locksmiths they can't find. While you may get a decent locksmith through AAA, chances are better that you will get an un trained/undertrained guy with a slim jim. Now granted if a AAA "locksmith" (and I use the term loosely) screws up your car, they will have it repaired (usually by the same "locksmith" that screwed it up)
Another problem with AAA is response time. If one guy they call says 30 minutes but his price is higher and the cheapest guy they can find says three hours, you gonna be waiting for three hours. They have no respect for your time, if they can get a better price by letting you wait.
Here's an alterative...
Get "Emergency Road Service" coverage on your *regular* car insurance. It's less than $10 a year (compared to AAA's $40+). You call who _you_ want (best ETA) and pay them out of pocket. Then get re-imbursed by your insurance company in a week or two. It doesn't effect your rates and there is no deductible.
Just something to think about.

It will do that but mainly it will slightly loosen threads which are locked tightly together. Just enough so you can turn without stripping it out. It's more often needed with large philips screws, torx allows for quite a bit more torque but they will still strip if you are not careful or especially if you don't have the bit seated all the way in when you torque it. If there is dirt in the working area of the fastener i.e. the "*" of a torx then clean it out with a sharp pointed tool and or tap the bit snugly into it before you apply torque.
The impact will often work great but make doubly sure that the bit is seated in good and snug because you won't have any time to react if it starts to slip to avoid stripping it. With the torx bit you can always combine the two tecniques into one step, put an extension on the torx bit seat it in the fastner and tap the end of it with a hammer.
If you do wind up having to drill some rivets to get access through the inner door it's not a big deal just replace them with short 1/4 or 5/16 bolts and a hexnut and lock washer. A die grinder with a cutoff wheel or thin stone will also make quick work of the rivets if you have trouble drilling them.