Six foot high deadbolt

(snip)

THAT'S GOOD! I never heard that one before. :)

self-deceived.

how do you know???

Jesus

where is it written that Jesus has a monopoly on GOD?? Catholics have their trinity deal going on which makes it more an oligopoly.

The foundation of my religion is Christ and Christ alone.

Since time immemorial, the powerful have used religion to distract the oppressed, to encourage them to focus on the next world so that they will acquiesce to the injustices of this world. If you would have your slaves remain docile, teach them hymns.

The Catholic faith is confession on Saturday. Absolution on Sunday. At it again on Monday.

Monotheists think all gods but theirs are false. Atheists simply don't make an exception for the last one.

Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. Anybody who wants religion is welcome to it, as far as I'm concerned -- I support your right to enjoy it. However, I would appreciate it if you exhibited more respect for the rights of those people who do not wish to share your dogma, rapture or necrodestination

Well, there you have it. I'm blessed to finally met the moral foundation and compass of the cosmos. Thanks for setting me straight.

Will you at least admit you don't believe in my religion? It should be easy enough seeing as how I only want to oppress the weak.

You ask where it is written that Jesus has a monopoly on God. What I was quoting was scripture. Do you want chapter and verse? It's written in the BIBLE. That was a fairly ignorant question. JESUS said HE has a monopoly on God. I repeat, Jesus said "I am the way, the truth and the life, no man comes to the Father except through Me". That is why the Romans and Jewish leaders conspired to kill him. It enraged them and it angers you. (Oh, btw, don't give me any crap about this phylosophy being exclusive. EVERYONE is asked to come, it excludes nobody).

The Christian faith is "relationship". It is a relationship with a God who not only exists, but communicates, loves, cares, forgives, blesses, and most importantly to me gives peace. He is a person. He is my dad. He gives me everything and only asks that relate to Him as His child. It's a pretty good deal if you ask me, but I your not asking.

Bob

And how exactly was I disrespectful?

I believe it was you that started the discussion by calling Chris a "wimp" and his God "imaginary". (Although he and I have some pretty distinct doctrinal differences, his God is the same as mine and I can assure you, He is anything BUT "imaginary"!)

_That_ would be considered disrespectful although I'm sure Chris would forgive you for it.

Then there was your defensive "hey pal.." reply to my post, when all I was doing was trying to point of some flaws in your self contrived theory. Something I did, (whether you believe/understand it or not), out of genuine love and concern for you, even though I don't know you from Adam.

I've offered to send you - at my expense - something to allow you to make an informed decision as opposed to just staking eternity on what is convenient to believe... and not some in-your-face religious track, but a book that is sort of a digest version of a best-seller by a well known and respected author.

I've gone back and re-read all my post in this thread and for the life of me I can't find anything disrespectful. I never said that only an ignorant, naive person would think that they could believe in all religions at one time. Not once did I tell you that you were on a road straight to hell.

I respect your right to believe anything you want and not once did I ever suggest otherwise. I simply presented an opportunity for you to investigate deeper, then make your own informed decision. Again, no disrespect intended.

However, you have made your feelings perfectly clear, so I will not bother you with the subject again, but know this...

If you are ever at a low point in your life in the future... be it next week, next month, next year, etc, know that I will be here for you. Feel free to contact me anytime. Day or night I'm not hard to find. In fact, I'm in the book. (No pun intended.)

Bobby

Folks, can we simply agree that we are going to disagree and leave it at that?

I don't object to folks wearing their beliefs on their sleeve (or their signature block). It gives me a data point on where they're coming from, which I can count in their favor or against them as appropriate to my own beliefs. If it's something I find personally unacceptable, I'll generally respond by killfiling them entirely... unless it's legally actionable or hate speech, in which case I'll ping their ISP and try to get their account shut down.

I don't think anything said here has risen (fallen?) to that level. People have stated their personal beliefs. I grant that's offtopic, but since it's mostly confined to their .sig blocks and those *are* generally considered a special case exception for brief personal expression, I really don't see anything worth complaining about.

I'm not a believer myself. I never will be. But I'm also sure enough in my conclusions that I don't find believers threatening.

And with that, I'll re-enable the killfile on this thread, since it REALLY isn't worth the time you folks are spending on it. Argument/debate will never change anyone's mind on this topic, since the divergence is at the level of basic assumptions -- which means that no matter what data you present, it will be interpreted differently and lead to different conclusions.

It only takes one psychologist to change a lightbulb. But first, it has to _want_ to change.

I don't think this is quite correct.

Exodus 20:3 (King James version) states:

Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

Those religions that use the old testament as their scripture could not argue that there is only one god as their scripture quotes their god as acknowledging that there are other gods, but forbids them from subordinating their god in the pecking order.

(Although he and I have some pretty distinct

You can make NO such assurances. If he is real, produce him, conjure him up.

Rog,

What that scripture ("commandment" - to be more specific) is referring to (in context with other teaching throughout the old and new testament) is not only false gods but also "gods" like money, power, etc.... anything that controls one's life.

The Bible speak specifically of several "false gods" such Baal who were (if one believes the Bible) shown to be false. (Or at least absent, off someplace else during the exam) ;)

The Bible also says that , "There is only one true God." Don't know the exact vs. (Memorizing scripture and verse numbers are not one of my strengths) but I can look it up for you later if you like.

Bobby

the bible is apocryphal, you can look that up.

My point, was that since the old testament a foundation for a whole lot of folks labeled monotheist, clearly indicates the existence of more than one god. I will leave it to you to adopt any theology you wish, my argument was semantic.

billb

I'm finished, and forgive me for not being kindly, gentle, and forbearing. You deserve better from me.

Two hands working can do more than a thousand clasped in prayer.

I said I wouldn't bother you with the subject again and I meant it, but since you specifically asked...

All I can do is show you Christ in me. If you want to experience God, YOU have to seek HIM. That's the way it usually works. There have been exceptions through out time, but it was by God's leading. I would never be so arrogant to think that I could "conjure Him up" like some kind of rabbit out of a hat. God doesn't work that way.

What you might try though, if you are serious about your request (as opposed to just trying to be argumentative) is to *sincerely* ask Him yourself to reveal Himself to you. That, I'm confident, He would certainly do. The only catch is, you must be absolutely sincere in your request.

So, like I said... If you are in fact sincere about wanting to know if God does exist, ask Him. Go off someplace by yourself and ask Him. nobody else has to know but you and Him. Then just "be still"... and listen *with your heart*. Not your ears. Not your mind. But with your heart. That's what God is interested in most/first.

See how much two hands clasped in prayer really CAN do. I ask you again, what have you got to lose?

:)

Bobby

You kids are all wet. Only the LDS / Mormons have the priesthood, and the Holy Spirit. We have continuing revelation, the necessary ordainances of salvation and exaltation.

All the other churches are wanabee pretenders.

Dear Joe, I was atheist for 27years. I know where you're at now -- I was there before. I won't press. Sorry to waste your bandwidth on this thread, and hope you don't see this.

That's a strong accusation and a contradiction of scripture.

John 3:16 Romans 1:16 Romans 10:9 Mark 16:16 Acts 2:21

Bobby

well, you see, the Mormons have John Smith and he was a necromancer, you others have nothing.