alternative to Hatch/Kohl 724 in the works

[ from ROL Re: Mark Bundick 'call to action' issue at 7/23/2003 12:51 AM ]
TRA and NAR endorse the Hatch-Kohl amendment and that is what they are
trying to push through the Senate. NAR and TRA are not trying to get Enzi's S724 passed by the Senate. If you do not support the Hatch-Kohl version of S724, do not write or fax letters to Senators to get hold removed.
I have been working on a compromise verison of S724 based on an idea from Senator Enzi that will not require rocketeers to have ATFE permits no matter what size motor, yet satisfy the concerns of Senators and Representatives. It more than goes halfway to meet any legitimate concerns.
I have been working with a group of individuals that represent a good cross-section of amateur, HPR and hobby shop owners. We think we have something that will be acceptable to most everyone. I plan to post this compromise version in a few days.
This compromise S724 based on Senator Enzi's idea is what the Senate should pass and what many of us will be pushing for. We do not endorse the Hatch-Kohl version of S724 and do not want to see that passed by the Senate. Consequently, we do not support the NAR-TRA "call to arms".
John Wickman
[ posted here by iz ]
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Aloha, You are going to have to be a bit more specific before anyone signs on. So far, you have told us nothing. Your post was absolutely ZERO-CONTENT. If you have a good idea, let's hear it. Just don't expect us to sign on without having a clue of what its going to be.
Best Wishes, Larry
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Me too, Zilla, I noticed that lack also. It kinda reminded me of the "spade in the hole" hint that was dropped earlier.
steve

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I agree, show your cards. Also, Mr. Wickman should be willing to post directly to R.M.R.
default wrote:

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He has a track record of showing his cards when his SENATOR approves it. Do you challenge the SENATOR's tactical practices in light of the hk724 buttfuck?
Jerry
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We are anxious to have this handled before 2003 ends, but in a way that rocketry as a whole can prosper.
All levels of rocketry are important to the R&D and maintenance of the human resource pool the U.S. requires to maintain our competiveness, if not leadership, in aerospace. Other countries not quite on the news horizon have substantial initiatives in this area, and any compromise of our capability would give them a considerable opportunity to overtake us. This would mean economic losses to us as a nation, and more importantly loss of a critical strategic advantage.
TRA/NAR are simply not looking at the impact of regulation at this scale.
Senator Enzi remains committed to the original S.724, and John Wickman is shoulder to shoulder with him in this struggle. This is a statement of fact. [ TRA/NAR's repeated efforts to obtain confirmation from Senator Enzi's office at every turn is quite unnecessary. ]
TRA/NAR recalcitrance is both unfortunate and counterproductive, but rest assured that we are quite serious in pursuing our original objective.
- iz

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I've contacted him indirectly, and been assured that he'll have public info soon. At this point my #1 concern is that any legislation that does get passed better solve our problems, not create new ones. It's unlikely that we'll get a second chance. But #1.1 has to be to do whatever Sen. Enzi thinks is the best course for s to get relief. He's absolutely the last person I'd want to piss off right now.
While it would be nice if John posted directly, Dick Embry certainly doesn't, and Bruce Kelly never did. None of our elected officials do, nore does anyone fromthe BATFE. In fact the only real rocket organization leader that does post here is Bunny.
    Bob Kaplow    NAR # 18L    TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD"         >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD! <<< Kaplow Klips & Baffle:    http://nira-rocketry.org/LeadingEdge/Phantom4000.pdf www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/ www.nira-rocketry.org www.nar.org
Save Model Rocketry from the HSA! http://www.space-rockets.com/congress.html
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<< While it would be nice if John posted directly, Dick Embry certainly doesn't, and Bruce Kelly never did. None of our elected officials do >>
TRA members get regular info these days via the TRA list.
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John Wickman assures us that an outlne of the compromise S.724 will be available ASAP:
"We will have it up this weekend. You can let [them] know. The legal wording will not be finished by then, but a detailed description of how it works will be."
I will propagate it once it is on the ARSA site, but you are welcome to check it directly as well.
- iz
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com (AkaZilla) wrote in message

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<< John Wickman assures us that an outlne of the compromise S.724 will be available ASAP >>
How's he expect to get it through the Judiciary Committee?
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I suspect that he doesn't intend to go that route. My guess is that he will advocate that HK 724 be brought to the floor, but not under unanimous consent, which will then open it up for admendments from the floor. Then a substitute bill can be proposed right there. However, I think that route is very dangerous. It is going to take a lot of convincing before I would actively support that tactic.
John Marvin snipped-for-privacy@fc.hp.com NAR 75392 L2
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Except the NAR approach if it results in ANY weight limits at all is not relief, but a step backward. So I am in NO hurry for that!
Besides this was a Wickman/Enzi project. Why is NAR mucking it up or doing anythinng at all but supporting whatever Wickman and Enzi are doing? Did they dislike the language of SB724? If so, how?
Jerry

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When it started to look like it would actualy succeed...? :-)
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<< When it started to look like it would actualy succeed...? :-) >>
And when will that be? So far it looks like a big screw-up.
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Jerry, NAR/TRA are not in favor of weight limits either. But they do believe that getting the H/K bill out of the Senate will make it easier to get a more favorable bill going in the House.

It affects us, so we have a right to be involved.
Ed wrote: <<Didn't NAR/TRA state that the Congressional effort, when it was started, was independent from the lawsuit, and that they counsled their members not to get involved? Is my memory so bad that I mis-remember that? If so, then when and how did the Congressional effort become a NAR/TRA run game?>>
Damage control.
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you have no idea what you are talking about
that fact notwithstanding, if TRA/NAR would work to save rocketry in any effective way, they would at least be useful
to date they are not
although they like to take credit for "grass roots" initiatives like the visit to the Senators
John W. is the only leader who has the attention span to move this forward, and the vision to see beyond his own front yard.
- iz

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izzy wrote:

Sig Heil! We wait further orders!
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snipped-for-privacy@acceptable-gains.com (izzy) wrote:

The pro TRA/NAR biased posters here cannot understand your message and are merely reactively annoyed by it. The very lack of vision that makes them effective shhple and HPR subscribers makes them anti-freedom.
Jerry
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wrote:

Some of them are stupid enough and pro-government biased enough.
Jerry
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