"just the facts, Ma'am. Just the facts." - Sargeant Joe Friday
I hardly see how posting information is "cram[ing]" it "down their throats". They can read it or not, and they have killfiles just like everyone else. Those who read it can act on it or not.
nope. I do NOT want to see "the destruction of TRA".
I want to see it do what it was created to do. Faithfully and effectively.
Read the AOIC, Ray. Then read up on "public trust", and "fiduciary responsibility".
thanks!
don't you realize that there is absolutely nothing that you can do to erase the past, or at this point even continue to conceal it? The more desperately you [and your editors] try, the deeper you reinforce the perception that there is more than a few reeking skeletons, with complete dental records!
but don't let me keep you from trying
even "silencing" or expelling me wouldn't help, far too many people have more than enough credible information now. The best thing you can do is willingly reform. Then at least the Alaskan Attorney General [and possibly the IRS] would see your acting in good faith and can be entrusted to do so going forward, should anyone choose to involve them for some reason.
Yet another thinly veiled threat. Cute. How can you possibly expect to convince anyone that you aren't trying to "take down" TRA when you keep making these threats against it?
But obviously you WILL try to destroy it if you don't get your way.
Your attempt to belittle my personally studied opinion fails.
Several days ago I read a post where you agree that TRA has need of some changes. Today I read where you say nothing needs changing. And after reading much to the opposite in your posts, guess what? AT is in bankruptcy. (Gee, didn't see that one coming... right?)
NO.
No place did I ever state your convolution of, "Jerry's "just tell 'em it's exempt" technique is the answer to all our problems". I have never said it was that simple. You belittle me and shallow my character when you convolute such things. We have a serious and deep problem here. Your attempt to make light to protect your perceived turf is plain outrageous.
Police opinion may control a person temporarily, but that does not make it law. Out of respect of the law, and the police, I may be required to put my rights "on hold" occassionally for what ever reason. But in the end, a nation will be what the people make it, not the police. YOU, Ray, agree to the very same things, generally speaking. In your complete and utter support of the perfect TRA corporation, YOU uphold and support the NAR/TRA lawsuit. YOU know the ATF has an opposite opinion. Do YOU think that is contradictory?
If your herein represented scope of opinions (via rec.models.rockets) are what TRA is, then TRA will eventually cease to exist. I will lament that day. But that is not contradiction. It requires thoughtfulness as to why a person might say such a thing. I would lament for what it might have become.
1 - Some people like to attack into territory unhindered for their own personal whim or gain.
2 - Some people will defend territory regardless of sense or correctness to a fault; blame shifting; scape-goating; etcetera, and have no sense of right or wrong; only perceived turf.
3 - Most people are somewhere between these two poles, or are apathetic generally.
Your refusal to acknowledge even the most obvious (like AT motor supply) has you IMHO buried deeply into the second typification.
I am neither attacking nor defending. I am a common "joe" who would like the hobby to survive the storm of fear and acquiescence. To that extent I question some of the existing practices that I see as harmful to the hobby, but I do not desire to see anyone "taken down".
FACT: I cannot get the motors I want at my local hobby shops. Yes I can buy them from afar at famine pricing, but that will not improve, nor does it solve, the current situation. I used to be able to get many locally.
FACT: The official membership the hobby used to enjoy was larger accountable numbers of people, on a smaller population base. We are now in damage control mode.
I am looking at trend here, not focusing on the past. I am looking for solutions. If I am able, I support solutions that benefit both myself and others in the hobby, including trying to correct causal factors to the current situation.
He's not trying to do it in, he's trying to correct a decade of abuse. TRA is morally bankrupt and has been for years. The only question is whether the members will clean their own house (too many are like Ray with their head in the sand), if someone will take legal action to force the issue, or if the continued corruption will cause the tree to rot out and die.
The easiest thing for Iz et all to do would be to resign, and let things collapse under their own weight. it may take longer than the first two options, but it's certain to happen if things don't change. The only question is whether we reach a point where it's easier to start over with a clean slate than it is to fix the rickety house.
For those newbies, I was a member of a credit union that unknown to the membership had a corrupt president and a BOD that knew about it but didn't care. When the real estate market collapsed in the early 90s, they lost over $18,000,000 in illegal loans the president made to his cronies. He fled the country, and the BOD raised fees on the members. The members revolted, called a special meeting, thrw out the BOD, and re-took the credit union. A few years later it won awards for its turnaround and has been a solid institution ever since.
Len, Jim, and a few others certainly know what I'm talking about.
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!
It's got something to do with some trivial matter like getting the organization to comply with the law and its own rules. But I'm sure that's something you can't comprehend.
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!
As I've stated before, local hobby shops are generally not rocketry oriented and are usually a poor source for anything other than Estes. Furthermore, please explain to me how this fact of hobby marketing is TRA's fault? While you're at it, explain how allowing Jerry to cert his motors without meeting any of the legal requirements for manufacture and shipping would have any effect on your hobby shop's ability to obtain AT motors -- or even Jerry's motors, which I've never seen in any hobby shop anywhere even before the motor cert process.
You keep claiming "famine pricing", but the F and G motors available online are only slightly more expensive than they were two and half years ago, before the AT fire and before the economy sank. Furthermore, as I pointed out recently, the price per newton second is less than you'd pay for Estes motors!
The fact that you may have had some local vendor who at one time was practically giving them away, and is no longer carrying them, is an anomoly and irrelevant to the overall market. And again, how is TRA to blame for your local shop's inability to obtain and sell motors at below market prices??
You refuse to accept that free market factors have any link to these issues and insist on blaming TRA for everything, without a rational basis for doing so.
Who cares if you don't like the way TRA fulfills its charter and mission statement? It's up to the membership as a whole to interpret that statement and decide how best to accomplish it.
But that's what you're afraid of, isn't it? That's why you would never run for BOD or do anything else that would put your agenda up to a vote by the membership. You don't trust the members to do things your way. And that's really what this is all about -- trying to force your will on everyone else.
That's also why you tout ARSA's lack of elections and lack of member control as a good thing. You don't want the members running ARSA, and you don't want the members running TRA. You're only interested in dictatorships that do what _you_ want.
Full of assumptions and garbage you know nothing about. The price of Estes has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with the how the market could look. Your pointing such out is POINTLESS. Estes does not do high power. Additionally your point fails on flight count. Your only solutions are to concede with out a whisp of care about the rights of the individual being trampled, and support the improper placement of power and control needlessly on the hobby.
Furthermore, you admit the prices *are* higher. Case made.
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