MDRA and flyer certifications

That's a California thing... not sure how parallel either the requirement or the availability of such licensing are to the regulations in other states.

-dave w

So what, can't a guy just build his L3 rocket on the field in front of God and everybody, fly it and certify, in one day?

Alan

Because they don't have a certification program & they require a TRA/NAR cert.

Do you expect them to change the rules just for you & Iz?

Phil Stein

Ferrell, why are you so adamant about not joining NAR? You'll have your own insurance coverage when you launch & you get a decent rocketry magazine every two months, in addition to all the other things mentioned enabling buying motors & flying. It's only 50 or 60 bucks a year. Are you the same Ferrell who was at a recent Great Meadows (VA) launch? With a high dollar name like Ferrell, I'd think money would not be an issue (the only other Ferrell I've known was an older idle-rich guy who 90% of the time I saw him & his wife they'd still be in their riding jodhpurs after a morning of riding their horses). -- Richard "a proud member of MDRA" Hickok

I am already a L3 flyer. I just want to give it a try, if for no other reason than to have an excuse to launch.

Unless I am way off base, this would not be within the rules.

I suggest jumping around and clucking like a chicken everytime she says this, particularly if you are in public. Even if she won't stop, the rest of us could use a laugh. ;-)

That sounds like a plan. Do some research on recovery systems, as that is where a lot of flights fail. Or you could just call Mike or Pam at Skyangle and tell them what you are doing, let them sell you the systems for each rocket, and follow their directions.

However...what is the rush? There is much to learn at each motor level, as some ideas scale well and others do not. With the L3 rocket in particular, how much of the construction will be based on your own ideas that you have developed as a result of experience vs. copying someone elses design? Not that copying is neccesarily a bad thing, I just ask with regard to personal satisfaction.

I don't know why he doesn't want to but I am interested in the conversation because people JUST LIKE HIM are in the super-majority.

Actually if they did it would open up the club to quite a few more people. Not sure if they like crowds of people or not :)

I did.

1. They don't live in PRK
2. Do you know how many Pyro Op 2's there are in CA? 5

Zero.

And none of them are you.

true ray, but this only applies to CA rocketeers...

shockie B)

"shockwaveriderz" wrote in news:bvtt6g$10jjgd$ snipped-for-privacy@ID-222312.news.uni-berlin.de:

What about white glue or epoxy rocketeers? We already know what to do with the hot melt guys...

len.

I believe jerry prefers model glue.

Dave Grayvis wrote in news:44vUb.3913$Jt5.2771 @newssvr31.news.prodigy.com:

You mean the stuff you squeeze into a bag and sniff?

(Experienced sniffer in a closed room. Do not try this yourself.)

len.

Read some of his posts and judge for Yourself.

ray: again, pyro ops license or "whatever" only exists right now in the state of PRK...

What we need are one or two things....

1. Have all states create their own State Rocketry Laws modeled perhaps after the PRK laws....where people get licenses/permits to do AR/EX rocketry and have to take a test...sounds like a certification to me..... NFPA 1 Chapter 65 provides for just this...... People in each state would have to work with their state fir marshall's to get this done.....I don't know if SFM in any state have the authority to implement license/permits like this without legislative oversight.....

The danger in this is you might end up with 50 states having 50 different rocketry laws...... G.Harry considered this approach back in the late 60's and decided going through the NFPA would be faster and more result in a more uniform law...

But as we all know...ONLY NFPA 1122 has really been adopted nationwide(sans

2 states), AND a few states do have additional requirements(at the model rocket level, see NJ/RI,etc)

NFPA1125/1127 have only been adopted in approximately 30 states....so its not a nationwide law .....yet......

1. Have Senator Enzi propose a "uniform model" Federal AR/EX Rocketry Law, where once adopted, it becomes law in ALL 50 states....this concept would allow for all states to adopt the same law.......this would apply ONLY to non commercial AR/EX rocketry activities..... It again might be modeled after the PRK permit/license system....It would function like hunting and fishing licenses do now....

The point is, one and for all, AR/EX rocketry would then finally have a legal status in all 50 states at both the state and federal levels....

And to stir things up even more, WHAT exactly are the L1/2/3 certs about anyway? From my reading L1/L2 is basically demonstrating a knowledge of the NFPA codes and the Safety Code....... SO if you are doing AR/EX and want to be certfied , my question is WHY bother(in the context of AR/EX that is)? the NFPA codes don't even apply to the AR/EX activities in the 1st place...... and with a couple minor changes both the NAR/TRA Safety codes could be adopted for a AR/EX Saftey code....

Instead of certifying on a Single motor for L1/L2... say an H for L1 and a J for L2.....I would propose a certification scheme based on tasks and degree of difficulty.......It would work something like this:

The simplest form of a L1 qualifying flight would be to use motor ejection charge to activate the recovery system.

the next activity task would be using motor ejection charge to deploy dougue and either a timer or altimeter to deploy the main.

the 3rd acivity task would be to use an altimeter for both drougue and main recovery system deployment.

the 4th activity task would be to use multi staged vehicle using one the 1st

3 recovery menas the 5th activity task would be to use a cluster(2/3/4) vehicle using one of the 1st 3 recovery menas

To be a 100% FULL L1...you would have to fly all 9 of the above tasks....say within a 2 year period?

Once you have accomplished the above you could go on to the L2 program ( which is just like the L1 but with larger motors)

so you might end up as a L1/1,L1/2,L1/3 through L1/9

obviously you would strive for both an L1/9 and l2/9 designation......Once you had achieved this you would then become Fully certified......

Finally the AR/EX community needs to understand that NFPA 1129 Code for Amateur/Experimental Rocketry MAY BE coming to a state near you soon....courtesy of the NAR/TRA...... My question is this: DO you really want the NAR/TRA codifying AR/EX rocketry into the NFPA framework?

shockie B)

Richard,

I'm not any of the Ferrell's that you mention above. The last organized launch that I attended was LDRS in Kansas. I have been to launches at Great Meadows, but that was at least 2 years ago. I have only been back in MD for the last 6 months; the 1 1/2 years before that I was in Minneapolis and we attended several of the TRA-MN launches.

I have been a member of both NAR and TRA for at least a couple of years. The ONLY thing that I am requesting is that any certification that I or my wife attains should NOT be taken away the first month that I let our membership lapse. That is something that, IMHO, is crazy. It is an impediment for me staying active in this hobby over the long haul. I do not mind being a member of TRA while I'm certifying (paperwork, etc), but once I'm an L3 I should be an L3 for life. As I said in another post, if I attain a Master Bladesmith certification (MUCH harder than attaining a rocketry L3) it will not be taken away from me the second my membership in American Bladesmith Society lapses. (Knifes from certified master bladesmiths DO fetch a higher price than other knives.) My other example is a PhD is not taken away the second a person is not a member of a professional society, etc.

So that is the only rule change that I would request with MDRA -- that certifications must be done while a member of NAR or TRA but are recognized by MDRA for life regardless of membership status of NAR or TRA. This seems like a simple change and does not require a parallel certification procedure -- simply issue a card saying the person is recognized L3 for life by MDRA. Can you make this an official request to the MDRA BOD?

Thanks,

Ferrell Wheeler Sunderland, MD

I thought there was a 1-year period before one needed to certify again.

-dave w