Quickburst shut down by BATFE

The local Austin paper ran an editorial of him in a clown costume. For once, I agree with the Austin Pravda. As an entertainer he might be fun, for a year or two. He has lots of one lines quips about current problems but very little depth. Most of his ideas require legislative support and possibly state constitution changes.

Personally I hope one of the "Independent" candidates win. Our Government needs a reminder that they are elected by the people to get things done and they have failed. I'll even "throw away" my vote by voting for a Libertarian this time around. Even a bunch of clowns could do a better job than the current crew. My motto for this election is "No Incumbent Left Behind".

Luckily, with respect to Kinky, the Texas Governor actually has very little power.

Reply to
Alex Mericas
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But it's not always true. Many years ago I voted for a governor candidate who I considered at the time to be a "no" vote. A vote to say "no" to both of the major party candidates, or as those candidates said "a wasted vote".

The guy I voted for made the often quoted comment "we wasted them with waste votes".

I think he did as good of a job as Govenor as his successor has.

Glen Overby, Twin Cities, Minnesota

Reply to
Glen Overby

If I had a choice between E-A and P-G, I'd vote for P-G. But if its E-A-1 and E-A-2, I'll vote for C every time.

Who would you vote for in a race between "W" and Hillary?

Reply to
Bob Kaplow

"Know what I pray for? The strength to change what I can, the inability to accept what I can't and the incapacity to tell the difference." -- Calvin

First of all, tell me who I could have voted for, or voted against, that would have prevented this case.

Second, please identify the federal form you were required to fill out. I'd like to look it up and see what kind of JBGT crap this really is. It had to have some form number, an OMB number, etc. A pointer to an online copy would be great.

Reply to
Bob Kaplow

I'll take him over the last two corrupt governors we've had here in IL. Or over the challenger we have this time.

Reply to
Bob Kaplow

Yarrrrrr! I be the Software Pirate!

Heave to ye lubberly geeks and prepare ta be accessed! Surrender yer passwords or be hacked!

Stand fast me hearties and make for a denial-of-service attack! Give 'em a broadside and bring all ports to bear!

Bill Sullivan

Bored at lunchtime again

Reply to
The Rocket Scientist

Why doesn't it have to?

Reply to
Glen Overby

Knowing what people know now or what they knew 7-8 years ago? Dubyah showed the people that voted for him a thing or two.

Phil

Reply to
Philip Stein

The FBI should be there by this time tomorrow - to give some excitement. ;-)

Phil

Reply to
Philip Stein

No doubt who I'd vote for, even though I'm not a fan of either, by any means.. The shrub (baby bush) could have been the "AHOLE" in my example!

Don't really care for Hillary but out of real "potential" people, I'd rather see her than the Shrub.. So I'd be voting against the Shrub, and not voting for someone who most folks have never even heard of...

But who I voted for would have more of an impact than if I voted for someone who didn't stand a chance from day one!

Reply to
AZ Woody

Why is one car pulled over when the whole highway is speeding? You can't get everybody at once, but getting one makes the rest slowdown. Quickburst is an example that will ripple through the hobby, getting others to put their permits right. This is no different than Performance Hobbies with the motors.

I don't believe that he was tagged because of the manufacturers or dealers permit. I believe he was tagged because he was selling to non-permit holders. You can argue about the igniters for modrocs as being unregulated but I don't think you can carry that to the e-matches and HPR igniters.

So who do we petition? There is really no sense in arguing amongst ourselves. We need to argue with ATF, at the very least for a definition.

Reply to
Thomas Koszuta

If they were manufactured without the proper permit, then it would be illegal to sell them, even with a dealers permit.

Reply to
Dave Grayvis

Not if You are using it in Your Great great great grandfather's muzzle loading firearm, or maybe a celebratory cannon.

Reply to
Dave Grayvis

You do if You plan on manufacturing road flares.

Reply to
Dave Grayvis

Arrgh! I'll show them me BitTorrent and overload their scurvy input buffers! Hoist the Tux and send the poxy Microsoft-users back to Davey Jones' cubicle!

Never piss off a software test geek.

Bill Sullivan

Reply to
The Rocket Scientist

But then you'd fall into the "intended use" category...

Reply to
Duane Phillips

Crush them, put the powder in ping pong ball lacquer and dip igniters. They work pretty good actually.

Kurt

Reply to
Kurt

IMHO, the LAST thing we need is a definition of "igniter" from BATFE. You mentioned three different "igniter" types that could be subsumed under a generic definition. BATFE will not complicate regulatory enforcement by making a list of several different types of "igniters". We'd get a one-size-fits-all interpretation that would make things easy for them, not us.

I have a different take on all this than most. BATFE was supposed to be an industry regulator. A federal watchdog and tax collector for the commercial explosives industry. Because of the incremental nature of bureaucracies and governments, they now have authority to regulate just about anything they say or feel is within their self-defined, ever expanding sphere of concern, including the actions of individuals.

Unfortunately, I do not believe they are concerned with the minuscule amounts and numbers of chemicals and devices involved in sport rocketry. NOTHING we do involves any technology which is not readily available to anyone with a library card or Internet access.

They are regulating rockets, not explosives. They USE their ambiguous definitions to their benefit in imposing more and more restrictions upon large sport rocket endeavors. They don't care about modrocs. They want rules in place to show their efforts at anti-terrorism when some dumb ass lobs an HPR bird with a "huge ejection charge" at a target.

The Feds are quick to point out that terrorists have binary liquid explosive technologies, are making or designing biological, chemical, even nuclear WMD's, and have "easy access" to real military weapons. But a piece of nichrome wire with a BP coating and >62.5 gram motors are so dangerous as to require regulation and permits.

Hey, BATFE and DOJ, do something useful for a change; instead of spending time dealing with hobbyists who are on your side, go find the real terrorists before they hurt more innocent people. God forbid that we have to ask you why you wasted time, money, and personnel resources fighting the NAR and law abiding hobbyists when you could have been looking for the Al Queda operatives who performed another terror attack.

Reply to
Gary

Darrell, you might remember my very similar rantings about this on the old Compuserve rocketry forum. We are in a classic predator/prey cycle of evolutionary adaptation with respect to ATF. It's stupidly counterproductive with respect to the general good but ATF is helpless to resist their bureaucratic nature. And rocketeers have no choice but to adapt or go extinct.

The only thing about all this that I got wrong in my rants of years past is that it is proceeding much more slowly than I expected.

It is no doubt frustrating to ATF that rocketeers have proven to be so adaptable. But this cycle of adaptive response is leading to a schism in the rocketry community between the LEUP haves and have nots. The haves adapt by getting permits. The have nots, being in situations where becoming fully licensed is simply not practical or possible, adapt by changing technologies. I see some strain from this occurring in my local club already.

Rocketry isn't going away anytime soon. But it is becoming increasingly a diversified tangle of different directions including a significant amount of return to the amateur rocketry of decades long past. This all ensures the survival of hobby rocketry but it also ensures a never ending cycle of measure and countermeasure. It's basically the messy biological way, not the neat, orderly, categorized system of typical human preference.

That's the supreme irony here: The harder ATF tries to exert control, the more it will lose control.

+McG+
Reply to
kmcgrmr

Holy ?!@#

Are you kidding? How many bombings does it take?

Did you forget Reno + Clinton calling for the registration of any group of 5 or more to combat grassroots efforts? How about Carnivore and Eshilon(sp). Tighter homeland restrictions ala McVey and David Koresh(sp). Giving technology to the Chinese enabling them to guide ICBM's to our cities. Thousands of FBI files of their opponents found at the White house.

Reno enabled the BATF as her private police force.

I could go on, and on, but you get the idea.

I hate any liberty taken from the people. I can only imagine the jail we all would live in had Al or Hillary been in power.

Reply to
Techie

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