Shows: GMTS or GATS

Personal opinion, from going to GATS shows in the Pacific N.W.. Portland, Salem).

All GATS shows are filled with crap (more dolls, toys, cast cars, cast airplanes than trains,) overpriced for admission, and fraudulently marketed to the suckers.

I did an actual count of tables at the GATS show at the Convention Center in PDX last November, 2004. The table count came in well south of

I still have the copies of the ads.

I also picked up a table "map" at the show, showing table layout and placement, as well as table numbers.

That "map" had a date on it of "May, 2004" and was labeled "Final Arrangement".

In my opinion, the GATS organizers knew months in advance that they were woefully short of vendors / tables to meet their advertised "hundreds and hundreds of tables", but never the less ran their fraudulent ads anyway.

If you go to GATS, go with lowered expectations.

And if the GATS folks are watching and want to complain about this report, I still have all the documentation, including the GATS "map"; the newspaper ads, my own notes, and my photos.

I sure hope the GATS folks want to threaten me regarding this report and demand a retraction. Why hell, they could sue me for libel.

I'm just going to love my counterclaim for fraud.

-- Jim McLaughlin

Please don't just hit the reply key. Remove the obvious from the address to reply.

I think it varies from place to place.

I haven't been to a good GATS in the North-East.

I made the mistake of assuming that teh one in Springfield MA would be good because that is the site of one of teh country's biggest shows. The Amherst show fills three large halls and even has traders from California (eg Joel Bragdon). But a GATS there filed a corner of one of these halls with not very many traders, even counting the dolls, whistles etc.

And then there was Rochester NY. In a small hall with only about 12 traders. Admittedly that weekend there had been a blizzard in Buffalo so a lot of traders couldn't make it - but even if they had there would have been maybe a dozen more because the hall wouldn't hold any more.

Yet when I went back to the Bay Area for Thanksgiving a month ago, I went to a GATS in Pleasanton. While this wasn't as good as other ones I had been to before a job chage took me to up-state NY, there were two fairly large halls and plenty of traders.

TABLE count, or VENDOR count?

Remember, each vendor has several tables, some a dozen or more.

Yeah, it's weaseling... but accurate, as far as it goes.

Yes, TABLE count, not vendor count.

I am not stupid and readily understand the difference, hence my original post, which mentioned nothing about Vendor counts.

And its not just "weasling" by GATS, nor is it accurate when GATS distributes at the show a document dated in May, 2004 showing a final set up of less than 140 tables, while advertising in print and tv media that there are "hundreds (plural, for folks like you who appear to be incapable of reading with comprehension) and hundreds (plural, again, for folks like you who appear to be incapable of reading with comprehension) of tables".

That is simply flat out fraud, an actionable common law civil tort, as well as a violation of the Oregon Unlawful Trade Practices Act.

-- Jim McLaughlin

Please don't just hit the reply key. Remove the obvious from the address to reply.

If you have never been to DuPage Cnty, Wheaton, IL Sunday Train Show.....

Go there and you should be impressed with 'Train Quantity'.... They have tons of O Gauge 3 rail Stuff...

I here there was a Entry Fee Price rise... a year back or so...

They usually have had 4 buildings full of Trains for sale......

Except during Winter... the outdoor display is missing...

I've been to Wheaton 8 Times in 5 years... GATs in GBay, WI once...

I'd certainly agree, at least as far as the NW is concerned. Our local clubs (Spokane) put on a swap meet twice a year, and they have more scale (and timplate) than GATS. And almost no dolls :-).

So which show(s) did you go to and what was / were your impressions and opinions.