An end to silly prices on eBay ?

On 02/02/2008 09:02, beamendsltd said,

With Recorded, what you're paying for is that proof of delivery, nothing more. Without it, yes it probably was delivered but how can you prove it if the buyer says they haven't had it?

Reply to
Paul Boyd
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You can't. But that's the point - delivery is the responsibility of the seller, so it's their choice whether to send something recorded delivery (costs them more, but protects them against dishonest buyers) or not (cheaper, but risks being fleeced by dishonest buyers who say they never received the item when they actually did).

Charging the buyer extra for a faster (or guaranteed next day) delivery is fine, as that's a benefit to the buyer, not the seller - and hence the buyer shoud pay for it. But recorded delivery is a benefit to the seller, not the buyer, so it's the seller who should cover the cost.

A lot of eBay sellers (and buyers, for that matter) don't seem to be aware of the fact that, in law, it is *always* the responsibility of the seller to make delivery (unless the item is collected in person), and if it fails to arrive (or arrives damaged) then the seller can't use the excuse that the buyer should have paid extra for insurance or recorded delivery.

Mark

Reply to
Mark Goodge

On 02/02/2008 08:57, beamendsltd said,

Whereas the rest of us just go to the Royal Mail website and print stamps off for no more than the cover price...

Reply to
Paul Boyd

And as a comparison - if you chose to sell only via a retail outlet in a local high street or retail park, then your "fees" (rent, rates, heat & light, phone) would be considerably higher, and you wouldn't get the same wide coverage unless you spent an awful lot on advertising!

Speaking as a buyer who's been "worked over" by a couple of unscrupulous sellers, I totally disagree. Why should I be given a retaliatory negative feedback by a seller who receives a legitimate negative from me after he sends the wrong goods, slowly, then refuses to make contact to remedy the situation?

Ditto buyers, I'm afraid! A seller provides a service to a potential purchaser for a reason - to make money. The customer should be treated fairly and with respect, as it is the customer who provides an income for the seller. Seems to me there are too many businesses these days who see customers as a hinderance and fail to recognise the whole concept of "service". In that respect, I think ebay have taken a big step in the right direction. As has already been said, if a buyer pays the correct ammount at the correct time, then why shouldn't the seller leave feedback there and then? The buyer has, after all, completed their side of the bargain. Sellers who don't like this have obviously, in my personal opinion, got something to hide.

Badger.

Reply to
Badger

On 02/02/2008 16:34, Badger said,

I'm both a buyer and seller, and I agree with Graeme in that it is heavily weighted towards the buyer. The forthcoming changes will make that even more so, to the extent that the number of sellers who leave will only increase more than it is already. You mention feedback - how about the bit about feedback where a seller will not be able to leave a negative or neutral to a buyer? That really is bizarre, and means that buyers only will apparently always stay at 100%. That will basically wipe out the feedback system as being a worthwhile tool. How about a serial non-payer, or an idiot that will decide that they can leave negatives for everyone knowing they will no longer be able to receive one in return?

When buying on eBay, you're buying goods, not feedback. What does it matter if you, as a buyer, get an unwarranted red cross? It doesn't affect your trading in any way. When sellers get unwarranted red ticks, it does affect their trading and if they're a business their profits are being affected.

That paragraph has made it blatantly obvious that you've never sold on eBay. Feedback should be left at the end of the transaction. The buyer has not completed their side of the bargain just because they've paid. Many, many sellers have been "worked over" by unscrupulous buyers. The classic example is a buyer who claims not to have received a delivery when they notice that the seller hasn't sent it by trackable means, which means that Paypal will give them their money back. Or a buyer decides for some reason that they don't like the item and try to blackmail the seller into taking it back. Or the buyer who doesn't like it, then breaks it and claims that's how it arrived. Or a buyer who decides to leave a negative after taking three weeks to pay, then complains that it took three weeks and a day to arrive? There are a load more examples, and you only have to look at the eBay discussion boards to find them.

eBay works both way, and feedback is an indication to other eBayers how the transaction went from both points of view. Incidentally, eBay themselves recommend that a buyer leaves feedback first to indicate to the seller that they are happy with the item and the transaction has been satisfactorily completed. In my opinion, a buyer has far more to hide by trying to blackmail a seller into leaving feedback first, and you will find that that is the opinion of the vast majority of sellers. With my buyer's hat on, I always expect to leave feedback first.

Reply to
Paul Boyd

On 02/02/2008 16:01, Mark Goodge said,

Exactly. And when I sell, I make a decision on how to send it. If I expect an item to reach a low value, I will price postage to not include tracking to keep the price down. If it goes for more than I expected, or I'm unhappy with the buyer's feedback (visibility that will soon be removed) then I'll send it tracked. I certainly don't expect the buyer to pay for my insurance!

Which is exactly what I said above and in an earlier post. Also as I said before, if a seller does expect me to pay extra for insurance, I just make sure I pay by Paypal and don't bother with the insurance. Many sellers just don't realise that insurance is to protect them, not the buyer.

Reply to
Paul Boyd

On 02/02/2008 16:01, Mark Goodge said,

Just spotted that - it's only the case if the seller is a business, not a private seller. eBay started as a means of putting private sellers and private buyers in touch, but now it's becoming a shopfront for businesses. eBay even put adverts on the pages that directly compete with listings!

Reply to
Paul Boyd

The definition of "business", though, covers a lot of people who are under the mistaken impression that they're a private seller!

Mark

Reply to
Mark Goodge

Wrong, I have, but the vast majority of my activity has been as a buyer and that's when I've had issues.

Maybe I'm simply too honest then...... I always pay immediately, If I know I'm going to be away from home at auction end time, I will send the seller an email stating this fact and not to worry if they don't get immediate payment but I will pay as soon as I am back home assuming I win the auction.

I have no real preference, other than when I give a seller feedback and they just don't bother to give any back to me. That annoys me.

Badger.

Reply to
Badger

But that percentage of up to 4.4% plus a fee is a drag on a profit if any you have made on the sale. By the way the fee is a different value depending on the Currency used. I also note that the Exchange rate the use is always poorer than banks and there is a 2.5% surcharge to Paypal as well. For once the Australians using Paypal have a small win. The fee that is added to the percentage of the total amount is lower for Australian users than USA, UK, Europe & Canada users. This fee is Flat fee will be charged as follows: $0.30 AUD payments in Australian Dollars, $0.30 USD for US Dollars, $0.55 CAD for Canadian Dollars, ?0.35 EUR for Euros, £0.20 GBP for Pounds Sterling, ¥40 JPY for Yen, 0.55 CHF , 2.80 NOK , 3.25 SEK , 2.60 DKK , 1.35 PLN , 90 HUF , 10.00 CZK , $0.50 SGD , $2.85 HKD , $0.45 NZD.

Reply to
Graeme

Or when sellers overcharge on "postage and packing", I once got charged for "time and fuel". I hate it when sellers "only post on Fridays", or "next time I go to the Post Office", and I think its totally unfair of those sellers only give feedback "at the end of the month"! Yes, I have had all of these conditions applied to things I have bought. On the other hand, I have never had a buyer who places such conditions on the purchase. Can you imagine the reaction from a seller recieving an emal from a buyer saying I only pay on Fridays, or at the end of the month, or I will send less because I am charging you the fuel that I use to drive to the bank. You are right. Ebay needs to return to its roots, as an "eBootSale" if you like, seperate the private seller from the E-store type operation, and get rid of this nonsense called feedback. Surely there has to be a better way. I dont have any answers, I wish I did.

scoot

Reply to
scoot

The latest unheralded move by LaPoste (France) having published the 2007 Postal tarifs, is to have insufficient hand-outs in the post offices and make what is available in the identical format to

2005 ( with the modest prices changes incorporated).

The one major but unstated change? In 2005, as before, the prices were based on a linear curve and so reflected the actual weight. The 2007 change was to make the datum examples (100 : 250: 500 grms etc) into the price steps! So now 101 travels at the same fare as 249 grms!

As I have been paying this tarif for over 12 months one could assume that I am unobservant but when challenged last week our sweet post lady admitted that the head office functionaires had spotted that the wording "just up to" could be thus interpreted. By my calculations it represents an actual increase in price of almost 30% (of any original value).

This plunged all my efforts to keep down postal rates on ebay into disarray and achieved the increase in postal rates so eagerly sought (in Paris) for more than 3 years. Until now it was cheaper to send out France than to post internally.

If the threat of stopping the use of cheques in the UK banking system ( due to dishonesty and high bank charges) carries through, it will become very difficult for people like myself to buy and sell within the hobby.

Regards

Reply to
Peter Abraham

"Paul Boyd" wrote

Not me - I always buy stamps & post parcels at the local Post Office. I need it to be there - use it or lose as the saying goes.

John.

Reply to
John Turner

On 02/02/2008 22:21, scoot said,

Don't forget that many sellers are just individuals who have full time jobs and not running businesses. Right now I'm not selling because my working hours mean I can only get to a PO on Friday or Saturday afternoons, and I can't get to a bank to pay in these quaint bits of paper called "cheques" at all. Now I could just put in my listings "only post Saturdays", but like you I don't like sellers that do that. However, so long as that's in the listing then you have the choice of whether or not to bid, and even though I may not like it, it doesn't really put me off. eBay do actually allow sellers to charge for time and fuel - the P&P costs are intended to cover *all* the costs involved with dispatch. As far as feedback at the end of the month goes, why not? Many sellers leave it in batches in one sitting. If you're a buyer, what does your feedback matter? FWIW, when I sell I aim to ship the working day after payment, and I charge a nominal 50p over the actual stamp price that more or less covers packing material costs. I leave feedback as soon as I know the seller is happy. Note the way I phrased that - I didn't say that I leave feedback when the buyer leaves theirs, but when I know they're happy.

But there are buyers who do exactly what you say! The "I'll pay you at the end of the month when I get paid" thing is very common and I've had that myself, and I've also had the "I do all my Paypal payments in hit every few days". So long as they tell me though, I'm not too worried. It's the ones that go silent for days on end that worry me! I can't see any reason why a buyer would need to drive to a bank to make a payment these days though .

Well, there I agree with you 100% :-)

Reply to
Paul Boyd

On 03/02/2008 08:47, Peter Abraham said,

That's what we have in the UK. When selling, finding you under-estimated by a smidgen thereby pushing you parcel into the next price band is extremely annoying!

The banks have said that they don't intend to phase out cheques, but the use of cheques is being phased out by traders so they will naturally die a death at some point. Many shops here no longer take cheques, and many eBay sellers don't take cheques either, including myself (unless asked nicely!) Really, these days there is very little need to write cheques out at all.

Reply to
Paul Boyd

On 03/02/2008 11:20, John Turner said,

I do post parcels at the PO because I want either a COP or Recorded slip. It just annoys me though when you stand in a queue for ever because everyone in front of you is doing anything and everything except use the PO as a PO,and they aren't doing anything to help profits. Oh, and those eBay sellers who choose lunchtime to post three bulging sacks of tiny little parcels ;-)

Reply to
Paul Boyd

There are a suprisingly high number of eBay sellers who demand cheques because of their perception of the high paypal charges. I keep my uk account for this purpose and between my wife and I, there are about 10 written per year.

In France cheques are used as freely as cash and efforts to put small money purchases through cards have not really caught on. The sole indicator of concern by traders is the insistance on more than one means of identification. Cheques are almost always printed at the cashiers desk by the computer and carry the address of the purchaser. These transactions are just as rapid as card transactions if the vendor is automated. Many French prefer it because it is easier to keep a record of spending whereas the card is not so obvious and especially if there is a problem after a length of time.

The cheque is also an indicator of "belonging". No one in this community or even further afield would query my cheque unless I was unknown or of a certain appearance. It keeps me happier than in the UK where even 20 years ago trust had done a runner with good manners.

Regards

Reply to
Peter Abraham

Doesn't help, believe me. I transferred all my business (which was considerable at the time) from the main post office in town to the nearest local sub post office and they shut it down anyway. Closures are decided on a purely geographical basis, not according to how much they are used. The main post office in town is also now being closed and its business transferred to branch of W.H Smith & Son. The counter staff have been told to sign new contracts with a cut in pay from £9.50 to £5.50 per hour and a requirement to work Saturday afternoons and Sundays for no extra money. A Royal Mail spokesman agreed the main post office has always been very busy. The main sorting office is also being closed and its business transferred to another town 35 miles away. Any letters now posted in Coventry to an address in Coventry will now make a 70 mile roundtrip by van.

The post office denied having plans for any more closures in the Coventry and Warwickshire area but a map appeared on their website showing an additional ten sub post offices already earmarked for closure. When the local newspaper brought this to their attention they deleted the web page and refused to comment further.

(kim)

Reply to
kim

Don't forget we now also have pricing by *size* as well as by weight which as someone else pointed out here before it was introduced, is a major handicap for those selling small, low-value model railway items on eBay. I've since decided to bin a number of mine even though they may be of interest to some modellers.

(kim)

Reply to
kim

Don't tell anyone but I never wait for *small* cheques to clear since the penalty levied by the banks for writing duds is about £20 a time. *Big* cheques are another matter altogether.

(kim)

Reply to
kim

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