Actors who served in the military

ROFLMAO !!

AM

That would be an ENTIRELY different off-topic topic, but thanks... lol

Actually it concerns me that the direction this country is pointed now is very dangerous, and I'm afraid that the damage is done. It'll take years and years for this country to recover from it. I'm afraid that I can't "get over" that; I love my country too much to turn my back on it.

--- Tontoni

are you sure you arent someone else who promised to leave RMS alone after failing to save civilization from W?

Stephen Tontoni wrote in news:tontoni- snipped-for-privacy@comcast.dca.giganews.com:

I am still waiting for one of you Kerry apologists and agaenda driven, intellectually dishonest characters to stop focusing just on Alabama (which I'll get to in a later post) and acknowledge the simple fact that Bush enlisted in the Air National Guard was trained and actually flew a high performance, nuclear missile capable interceptor. Your insistence on focusing on the allegedly missed service in Alabama whilst flatly ignoring his service in Texas is ridiculous and insulting. I concede nothing. If there was actual evidence then the Democratic flunkies would not have had to stupidly forge documents in a way that was easily detected, suggesting his detractors knew so little of the military (and are so divorced from reality) as to think that such "evidence" would have any credibility.

Had there been a shred of actual evidence false evidence would not have to be manufactured.

And the Swift Vets are extremely credible. They each tell very similar stories of a fairly incompetent, cowardly glory hound. And Kerry's refusal to release his records frankly allows one to assume the worst, if they would exonerate him, why not release them.

So indeed let's recap.

Gore went to Vietnam and was guarded by another soldier who might have been more valuable elsewhere because he was such a valuable human being, the fortunate son of a Senator (who I believe voted against the Civli Rights Act).

Clinton flat lied to the draft board, did not sign up for ROTC as he promised, then went overseas, didn't smoke pot, didn't complete his term at Oxford and traveled to the Soviet Union via Sweden and stayed in a very nice hotel usually reserved for special guests of Soviet Union, all whilst a poor as a churchmouse student.

Kerry spent a good deal less than his year, claimed Purple Hearts for wounds that other men said they would have been embarassed to put in for. When he got home early he lent his "credibility" as a combat officer to a bunch of anti American scumbags, lied about what was happening claiming to have witnessed atrocities that noone else has ever verified (having shot a man in the back himself). He went to Paris while still an officer in the US Navy and participated in talks with North Vietnam in direct contravention of his responsibilties as a serving officer. His picture hangs in some communist hall of heros in South Vietnam as having helped the North in it's cause in murdering and subjugating a people.

Meanwhile:

Jan. 19, 1968: Bush completes Air Force officer qualifications test in New Haven, Conn., while attending Yale University.

May 27, 1968: Walter B. Staudt, commander of the Texas National Guard, interviews Bush and recommends he be accepted for pilot training. Bush's application for enlistment in the Guard is approved.

June 1968: Bush receives bachelor of arts degree from Yale.

July 12, 1968: A three-member Federal Recognition Examining Board reports Bush is qualified for promotion to 2nd Lieutenant in the 111th Fighter Interceptor Squadron.

July 14, 1968: Bush attends basic military training in San Antonio.

Aug. 25, 1968: Completes basic military training.

Nov. 26, 1968 ? Dec. 2, 1969: Attends undergraduate pilot training with the

3559th Student Squadron, Moody Air Force Base, Ga. He is trained to fly standard Air Force aircraft, including the T-31, T-37, and T-39.

Dec. 29, 1969 ? Jan. 20, 1970: Trainee, 111th Squadron, Ellington Air Force Base, near Houston.

Jan. 11, 1970: Assigned flying duty as a pilot of F-102 fighter interceptors, 111th Squadron at Ellington.

Aug. 24, 1970: Three-member board recommends 2nd Lt. Bush for promotion to first lieutenant. Bush later receives the promotion.

1971: Participates in drills and alerts at Ellington. Begins work for Houston-based agricultural company.

I concede nothing buddy. Bring on whatever you got. The truth WILL prevail.

I've been poking around articles on the internet regarding Bush's services, and the water is murky to say the least. It seems to me that writers are putting spin onto what ever facts that they can grasp, depending on their ideology. Here are a few URL's, supporting both sides of the controversy, that I pulled up. It's as reliable as we know the internet is... in other words, read between the lines:

The only matter that is in question regarding Bush's service was the year that is allegedly missing from his service in the Alabama ANG. I have no questions about his service with Texas ANG.

Again, my point was that Kerry went to Viet Nam and saw active service. Bush did not. Gore went to Viet Nam and saw active service, albeit with a camera. Bush did not. Even had Bush completed his requirements with the ANG (and he probably did) he has not been in nor has he seen a fire-fight except on TV.

Regarding Kerry deserving the medals or not, that's highly subjective. In addition to the 3 purple hearts, though, he was awarded a number of other medals. (here they are:

So Kerry's service in Viet Nam isn't just about whether swiftboat vets thought that the 3 purple hearts were warranted or not.

And honestly, at this point, I don't even recall what the initial discussion was about, which frequently happens when talking to conservatives! (that's a joke, by the way... sort of)

--- Tontoni

(and one further PS... I didn't care for Kerry as presidential material. He's an intellectual windbag. Kerry's entire platform was "I'm not George Bush".. and that was nearly enough for him to win the election. I don't know anyone personally who was REALLY a Kerry supporter. Anyway, that Kerry came as close as he did to winning shows just how ready this country was to get rid of Bush.)

That is correct. However, the reason he left is that his term of enlistment was up.

Doug

Let's hear about your record, hero--you're the one denigrating the service of men who went to Viet Nam, at a second-hand reach. You ignore the statements of the crew who served under Kerry and the man whose life he saved--are they liars as well? What was it like when YOU were there?

Credible? Are you serious? They were anything BUT credible.

Actually, most of them, including Swift Boat Veterans for "truth" leader/spokesperson John O'Neill, never saw Kerry in Vietnam.

Similar stories? Not really. I mean, they did get together in an Arlington VA hotel before their two news conferences and, shall we say, "compare notes", but there were very few of them present for any of Kerry's combat incidents to do any comparing.

You mention (later in this post) something that allegedly happened during the incident where Kerry was awarded the Silver Star. That incident is an example of what I'm talking about -- something like

25-26 Americans there that day, but not one single member of the Swift Boat Veterans for "truth". Strange, isn't it? They would have you belive that damn near every guy who ever set foot on a Swift Boat belonged to their organization, but out of all the guys there that day, not one member.

Whoops, there was one (just one) member present that day. But he supports Kerry being awarded the Silver Star for that action.

Amazingly, you won't find that in Unfit for Command.

Too bad, as it would have been nice to have some truth here and there in that book. . . . . . .

Just about every record he had was upon his website during the election. And then he signed a Form 180 recently which allowed AP, the LA Times and Boston Globe to have direct access to his records. They found nothing new, other than his grades were one point lower than GW's at Yale . . . .

More specifically, other men who didn't like Kerry said they would be embarassed to put in for. Thousands of others DID put in for similar wounds. And I assume you know that he still has shrapnel in his leg from one of those wounds.

And here we have it -- a Swift Boat Veterans for "truth" sound bite that is nothing but shameless and dishonest, to say the least.

If, in fact, he had shot that guy in the back, so what? It was in the middle of a firefight. One doesn't ask the enemy to turn around in those circumstances.

You did realize the circumstances of that situation before making that comment, didn't you?

But he actually did NOT shoot him in the back. He has said so the one time he was asked directly. Plus, another Swift Boat officer on the scene saw the killing wound, and it was not in the back.

Needless to say, none of this is in Unfit for Command, the SBV"t" book of fairy tales.

Doug Reese

PS. Your comment below on Kerry's photo in the war museum in Saigon is also false, but I realize what your source is, and about all I can say is that you should get another book/source that contains something closer to the truth.

LOL.

Irony.

E.P.

" snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

Four words. Dan Rather. Fake memos. 'Nuff said.

Why would a person who had 30 years or more in as a "journalist" who was supposed to be an honest unbiased reporter of fact do such a blatantly stupid and dishonest thing.

1) agenda driven 2) intellectually dishonest

I think Reagan never went anywhere based on two factors, age and , more important, eyesight. It was not for lack of trying.