Art took a serious pounding on rec.photo.digital !! I'd seen his web, and have a lot of respect for his wartime experience. That said, he is a more serious asshole than Vess by far. And he didn't take his beating like a man, even after several people (me too:) warned him it was coming.
People like Vess, and Art always try to come off as being reasonable, moderate people, even while they are using four letter words to attack someone !
This is why a liberal mentality will always escape me......