TRIX OO Scale products?

It sounds about right to me. The business plan (using a modern term - I know) was for manufacturers to sell *thier* system. In other words you had Hornby Dublo trains or Tri-ang trains or whatever... and basically pretended the others didn't exist, certainly the manufacturers did so. It was only when Tri-ang took over the Hornby Dublo range that a converter wagon or horsebox became available. BRMSB certainly seemed to accept anything, quite different to the NRMA where they patiently persuaded almost every one to using a common, but not finescale set of standards.

Everybody seems to forget that these started as toys, and as long as things weren't too obviously wrong they were acceptable.

Peco did conversions - Triang to Peco/Hornby couplers and vice versa, three-rail to two rail wheels etc.

I remember converting the Triang Green suburban coaches to go behind my Brother's Hornby Southern 0-6-0 tank engine.

A lot of people mixed and matched this way. Hornby locomotives were generally better than Triang, with the Triang rolling stock better.

We also put Peco couplings on Airfix's two-bob wagons.

Jim,

I think you are right.

The situation as I see it just after the war, say before 1950 was :-

Trix producing in a bastard scale Hornby Dublo in 4mm scale on HO track Rovex and GF not started.

So if HD, who had only three loco castings in production or developed ie A4, N2 and Duchess, had said OK we will from here on in go for HO rather than OO it would not have been much of a problem. Much of the rest of the system was tinplate bodies on cast chassis. How hard is it to make the next run of tinplate sheets slightly smaller and replace the moulding tools when they wore out?

Trouble is Meccano Ltd were rather set in their ways even then; there is the Meccano way or the wrong way.

If they had taken the plunge then the others would most likely followed on.

Trackmaster, the precursor of Rovex and Triang, owed much of their market to the HD influence, so if HD had gone HO so would Rovex and Triang who followed on having bought the Trackmaster tools.. After all Triang used that totally meaningless OO/HO scale slogan so they were not unaware.

What of the scratch builders I hear you cry! They would do their own thing but those who were into modifying would have taken their lead from commercial offerings.

I suspect that a great deal of the attraction with 4mm scale is that it allows measurements across the metric/imperial system with apparent ease whereas HO seems harder.

Trouble is that all this did not happen because of the investment in three locos by a company that were by that point not very forward looking. It also meant that Meccano Limited sowed the seeds of their own destruction, it might have taken twenty years but that decision killed the company.

Paul

"Jim Guthrie" wrote

But there had been no production of any of these since 1939-40 due to WW2. There was a basis of models in OO-gauge which were of acceptable quality and the tooling for which would not even have covered its costs since the range was introduced only in 1938. It would have been foolhardy to contemplate changing scales in the aftermath of the War, especially as production was aimed at the toy market, there being no established model railway market to aim at.

Anyway what point would there have been in changing at that time? Remember we're talking TOYS not models.

John.

John,

I'll try and locate the magazine articles I read about the immeduiate post war period.

At that time there was sufficient interest in the model railway hobby to form the BRMSB and there were two (or three - can't remember when the Modeller started) well established magazines. The Model Railway Club in London seemed to be the leading centre of ideas, but the Manchester club was in the forefront of cevelopments like EM.

And British modellers seemed to be well aware of what was going on in the USA and the Continent. I know that the S Scale Society in the UK (formed in 1946) decided to adopt the US 3/16" scale and track standards instead if H1 (Half One) at 5mm scale which was being developed prewar in the UK

And I've just had a dig around the web and found this about the war time period.

Jim.

"Jim Guthrie" wrote

And what was the membership of the BRMSB? A couple of dozen at most I'd guess.

I'd have thought that only Model Railway News was published in the post-War late 1940s, with Railway Modeller (originally owned by Ian Allan) following in the early 50s and Model Railway Constructor (owned by Ian Allan) a little later.

Ian Allan didn't think there was any future in model railways which is why it sold Railway Modeller to Peco, only to realise that there was indeed a future and had to launch a new publication.

John.

"John Turner" wrote

Which just shows how wrong you can be - the undernoted information from

a) from Alan Esplen:

Percy Play Train was introduced 1965 in 1969 became Play Train without the face. These were were plastic, no electric, push along & wind up with a key. No idea when production ended. Info from Hornby Companion series.

b) from Nicholas Oddy:-

The Percy trains were always clockwork with an interesting over-ride on the gears that allowed the loco to be pushed along the track without damaging the spring. This was achieved by having the second gear spindle end mounted in a slot, when the spring drove the physics of the arrangement forced the spindle to the bottom of the slot and the gear was engaged, however when the gear train was driven from the wheels the reverse happened and the gear bounced harmlessly out of engagement with its pinion. Percy mechs were always key wound as a consequence, and used the standard diecast key supplied with the types 40 and 50, but with the 'Hornby' lettering deleted. The mech cases were adapted from the M1, and I think that some of the gears might be the same size, but the arrangement in the mech is entirely different with braking from the side and no reverse, let alone the override system. The mechs were available from Hattons for many years, with massive discounts for quantity purchase (either £2 or £4 for twenty I seem to remember!) A (now deceased) friend of mine who built small production runs of toy/model locos used to use them in push-pull couples of 0-4-0 North British tank locos, one with the mech reversed. One loco could safely pull the other about, and the same in reverse! Heavens knows how many he turned out but I have pair, complete with 'Granton' over-smokebox destination plate on the smokebox of the forward loco and 'Edinburgh' on the bunker of the rear in true NB style. Quite delightful.

John.

Takes a man to admit he was wrong! ;-)

(kim)

So the dealers and customers who had waited patiently six years for the

(kim)

If there's anyone in this group I haven't yet managed to offend, please be patient. I will get around to you eventually.

(kim)

than a small group of modellers, no organisation, just an impressive title. Analysis shows their standards are flawed and should be avoided if you want reliable running. Another reason successful RTR manufacturers did not embrace the standard.

The NMRA has not persuaded everyone to use their standards. Like the BRMSB standard wheel profiles and widths are often followed, but RTR track is not to either standard. Both the NMRA and BRMSB standards should be avoided, if you want reliable running with RTR 00 equipment.

Terry Flynn

DC control circuit diagrams

HO scale track and wheel standards

Any scale track standard and wheel spread sheet

It's amazing how much debate one little passing comment can generate.

Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2006 14:07:27 -0400

"Perhaps the real pity is that Hornby didn't go for HO!"

"kim" wrote

LOL - I feel quite left out!

Sits back and waits for the attack!!! ;-)

John.

"kim" wrote

Touché !

John.

Model Railway News started in January 1925, Model Railway Constructor in March 1934 and Railway Modeller in October/November 1949.

AS you rightly say John, Ian Allan started the RM then sold it to Peco (after only 12 bi-monthly issues) in 1951, but the first issue of MRC under Ian Allan ownership was January 1960, after Ian Allan bought out Railway World Ltd.

"John Nuttall" wrote

Didn't realise that MRC was that old! Thanks for enlightening me.

John.

No problem John. For the avoidance of doubt, I wasn't there at the time :-)

Hardly, this is a UK newsgroup and it is an emotive subject. It's a bit like telling muslims they should worship Jesus instead of Allah.

(kim)

"kim" wrote

Nah, the latter would be a capital offence, slagging off British HO is only good sport. ;-)

John.