FAA Waiver question


Kind of shoots the impression that people there are realitively smart, right between the eyes.
If it happens that often, you need to get yourself a video camera and stake out a busy intersection. You could make some money providing crash footage to the local tv station.
Randy www.vernarockets.com
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Well that is great and everything. But what does it have to do with the issue at hand?
--

snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com


"Tai Fu" < snipped-for-privacy@aol.com> wrote in message
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My reaction to this is so what. It is not regulated. Better to not be a squeeky hinge. It seems you have been oiled. Welcome to the party. My section went though this last year as you probably know from when you were on NAR Sections.

The fly in the ointment... Do you have any real confirmed reports of near misses or safety violations on your part? Or is the airport manager operating under paranoia? I will assume the latter.

Yep.
Yep.
Yep. Welcome to the party pal.

So simply notify and launch your low/mid power rockets. If you even have any HPR to do, deal with it at that time. But do not screw the pooch if it isn't needed. And frankly it sounds like you did yourself in on this deal.
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I suggest you go higher rather than be a victim of these threats. ANd report them to their superiors.

For 101.22 notification, I usually use 3000', as that's about the peak for an AT kit with an AT motor. Sure, a G25 in a minimum diameter bird can go higher, but that's not what we encounter at our launches. Giving them an absurdly high ceiling just makes your problem worse.

It doesn't say no aircraft in sigth. It says you can't create a hazard to them. A let at 37000' over your Alpha is not a hazard.
The original draft of the NAR HPR code did have the "aircraft in sight" clause. I got it removed by insisting that I would enforce it at NARAM-33, which was NAR's first ever HPR launch, 19 miles from O'Hare field. There would NEVER be a window we could fly under that rule.

We have had more problems with random individuals at small regional airports than at ORD.

Get in touch with my FAA contact in the Chicago area. He's helped with problems like this before. There is also someone at the Kankakee FSS who is actually writing an FAA document on rocket launches. He's L1 certified!
--
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)! <<<
Kaplow Klips & Baffle: http://nira-rocketry.org/Document/MayJun00.pdf
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I am not sure what is going on with kankakee. Many time this year when we called them to notify, they wanted to do a waiver. The problem is that is not why we were calling them. IMHO they seem totally confused on the whole deal. And the L1 guy is sort of not in the loop as far as I can tell. He used to work for TRACON... So he was associated with your FAA contact in chicago.
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well I just got off the phone with the Principal Operations Inspector at the Louisville FSDO office and he agreed that the waiver was not needed as we will be flying ONLY model rockets and Large Model Rockets and he also is going to have an "education" talk with the Bluegrass Airport ATC Manager.
SO it looks like we will now be able to launch MR/LMR at MSP without any further interference from the ATC guy. MAybe after we get in a few MR/LMR at MSP later next year we will try for a %K waiver to do small H HPR.
thanks for everybody that contributed
shockie B)

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Ironically you were always able to do this... They have no say so if you properly notify.
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> at MSP later next year we will try for a %K waiver to do small H HPR.
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Greg Cisko wrote:

Greg,
Not wanting to pick a fight but a fellow here once posted that the FAA nixed a launch even with notification and gave the reason the launch was too close to an approach path to a runway. They insisted they had the final say as in there eyes it was a safety issue. Am only repeating what I read and not stating an opinion. Kurt Savegnago
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You keep saying that you want to fly at "MSP" To the FAA MSP is the Minneapolis Saint Paul International Airport! They love their Three Letter Acronyms, and there is only one meaning per TLA. :)

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And it's a nice sunny balmy 40 degrees here with the wind coming from the North at 10 mph...perfect flying weather :)
Ted Novak TRA#5512 IEAS#75
Jim M wrote:

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(ducking) ... and it's a nice 85 degrees, with clear, blue skies, here in southern California... (well, there is a LITTLE wind..)
David Erbas-White
tdstr wrote:

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Show off :)
Ted Novak TRA#5512 IEAS#75
David Erbas-White wrote:

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tdstr wrote:

40 degrees Celsius? That is warm. :)
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Nothing like a bunch of rocket nerds in a pissing match. This must be a new low for the Internet...
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

    I'll bet we could find something lower if we looked hard enough, but that's definitely the wrong direction for rocketeers to be going.
    I remember back when I still thought it was important to "beat" people in arguments on the internet. I probably did learn something from some of those arguments, but not nearly enough to justify the time I spent in them. And I'll bet that the people I was arguing with learned nothing at all. And of course once you get into a "pissing match" (as you so aptly describe it), you're a guaranteed loser anyway. As the (terribly non-PC) joke goes, arguing on the internet is like competing in the Special Olympics: even if you 'win', you're still a retard.
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Not to mention our sport is in serious jeapordy. The last thing we need is a bunch of dolts hiding behind what they percieve as the relative anonymity of the Internet to beat their chests.
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Last thing we need is the first and most prevelant thing we have.
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snipped-for-privacy@everywhere.com wrote:

Sad, jerry, sad.
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On 21 Nov 2005 07:07:47 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Not even a low for rmr let alone the Internet.
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Phil Stein wrote:

I thought it was interesting. Didn't realize Shockie's dilemma would stir up much sentiment.:) Made the current rules very clear to me. I still would propose that it would be nice if the rules were changed to anything under 1.5kgs. and less than G would require no notification. Anything above, requires a waiver. I have a waivered field I attend and fly my 530gm, 750gm and 850gm models legally. Computer says 900', 1200' and 1200' respectively in anything from F to G motors. Would be nice if I could fly from in my field 2 minutes from my house on the spur of the moment but just do the less than 453gm. models with less then G power. I could fly the models above that but don't
Kurt Savegnago
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