[Trolls} Received the holy grail and are silent

Isn't kelly "out"? Why are you even mentioning him?

He is sooo not "out".

What are you talking about? Do you even know?

I try.

I am imprefect.

Who volunteers to do that in Orem,UT?

TRA HQ Tripoli Report publisher (propagandizer?) Official magazine publisher (late or neverer?) NFPA committee (bad rule criminalizer) Lawsuit committee (can't read and understand 27 CFR 555.141-a-8) and more

More importantly, a 10 second delay could test at 8 seconds or as long as 12 seconds and it would be within spec.

Consecutive firings of the same motor could vary differently each time.

If You need it more accurate than that, get a timer.

I didn't suggest that he was on the BoD, I suggested that he had some control of communications

I most certainly did, but as the ensuing conversation took place on the TRA listserv I am prohibited from reposting it here

as I said, I most certainly did

In my original request of January 16, 2004 I offered to reimburse acceptable "cost[s] of reproduction and mailing"

my view of acceptable costs would be the gross hourly wage of an office worker (the wages paid by Tripoli to HQ for example) multiplied by the number of hours used in assembling, copying, packaging and mailing; as well as the material cost of paper and toner, packaging and finally the cost of postage

I think this reasonable compensation to an organization for satisfying their legal requirement of disclosure to a member

but the more interesting conditions were that an "acceptable purpose" must be "deemed proper", as if investigation into allegations of misconduct to independently verify or rule-out such misconduct could ever be 'improper' when engaged by a dues-paying member of a 501c3 IRS corporation and a non-profit corporation under Alaskan statute with a fiduciary responsibility to its members

also note that the minutes are claimed to be "copyrighted", which would necessitate that the official corporate record of a non-profit corporation was also copyrighted - which is impossible

I found the permission [upon prior approval] to limit copying to hand-written notes which I would be prohibited from discussing with anyone (reproduce verbally) without prior written permission particularly amusing

so while BK acknowledged my legal right as a member to have access to content, I could not share the nature or substance of that content with another member despite their possessing that same legal right

hmmm ...

as I said, I was showing evidence that BK had some control of communications

for an example of responsible corporate conduct regarding member inspection of corporate records, see the Revised Model Nonprofit Corporation Act (1987) at

which includes provision for the member to both copy records as well as "the right to receive copies made by photographic, xerographic, or other means"

not merely handwritten notes

- iz

A clerical position.

He doesn't write them, he just gets them printed and mailed.

If you want that job, you can buy the magazine from him.

As opposed to you, a mere criminal. If you think you can do a better job on the NFPA, why don't you get yourself a seat there?

And you can't read and understand the ATF's published policy stating that motor manufacturers must have LEMPs.

m

Wrong again. He's just the guy running the office. If you don't like the conditions set forth for your request, take it up with the BOD.

Handwritten notes fall under the category of "other means".

I'm not squirming. You seen to be the one trying to twist my posts into insults. Sheep are really good creatures. You brought sheep into the discussion. I used the compact phrase "sheeple", meaning that that the TRA membership is led by a strong intolerant administration. By contrast The NAR has weaker administration. Bundick in particular set up his tenure as a member driven leadership style. Essentially Mark is just asks the members where they want to go, and he facilitates membership initiatives. If you feel dissrespected being a follower in an association with strong leadership, you could try a different association.

Nobody seems to be flying figs except you. You should just fly rockets instead.

S&T does not run AT or any other motor producer. S&T certifies motors for use by members and other consumers, and makes the test data available so they know the performance of the motors that they may wish to use. Product labeling is a function of the manufacturer, not S&T. Naturally S&T wants manufacturers to use clear labeling and marketing, but they have no control or enforcement tools. All S&T can do is deprive its membership of the opportunity to fly good but poorly labeled motors by decertifying them, which is in nobody's interest. It is the manufacturers responsibility to use motor designations that accurately reflect the actual delivered performance. You are assigning fault to S&T when the fault is entirely the manufacturer's.

So mister pass/fail now wants some middle ground? There is not only middle ground, but a continuous spectrum between irresponsible and prudent. I don't give breaks, YOU place yourself somewhere in that range.

There are people who do not fly sport rockets because the motors are not reliable enough for them. My standards are doubtless higher than most, but I still fly. I do try to minimize my risks, and that means that I do not fly with suspect motors.

Alan

Then call him. Maybe he'll send you some stamps.

Do you really expect anyone to believe that you use of the term "sheeple" was not derogatory? Everyone I know would consider it an insult. How about you, would you mind being called a sheeple?

Another derogatory insinuation. Wait, let me guess, now you're going to say that "intolerant" is a compliment.

I feel disrespected by your snide insinuations that our leadership is "intolerant" and that we are nothing but mindless sheep. Furthermore your denials are an insult to my intelligence.

Cute, but evasive. What "activists" were you referring to, and would anyone care about your regard for them?

The fault is S&T's, because they certified motors that fell outside the allowable level of variability. Why even bother with certification if they aren't going to hold manufacturers to the required standards??

Name one, besides youself.

So fly with whatever motors you think are worthy of such an exalted one as yourself, and leave the hobby stuff to us lowly hobbyists.

It is descriptive. You "feeling" it is derogatory, aside, it is descriptive.

Are they insulted because they are sheeple and they do not like that noted?

It is descriptive. You "feeling" it is derogatory, aside, it is descriptive.

THAT is a "derogatory insinuation".

THAT is a "derogatory insinuation".

So yours are obviously MEANT to be an insult to mine then?

Care to back up that libel with a fact?

Jerry

"I am sorry, but did Bob actually say that? It appears you are quoting him. If you are not quoting him, then this is an a-hole like manouver. I mean really. What are you trying to do here? It seems like the ultimate that a jerk would try to pull off."

- Greg Cisko

"Well maybe there is something to it then. I hate to say it, but a few in my section tell me Jerry has a point."

- Greg Cisco

Because he's still rejecting peoples memberships.

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)!

Believe it or not, I have some friends in the SLC area... Was out there twice just a few months after the Olympics, the company I used to work for had an office half a mile from the hockey venue...

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)!

Then the clerk seems to be rejecting potential members on his own.

And putting requirements on people who want to access official IRS501c3 records.

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)!

That is something I hope is being addressed this weekend.

-Kevin