[Trolls} Received the holy grail and are silent

Had it for YEARS and didn't know it.
IRONICALLY if TRA simply renews USR motors per its own rules, they will be 100% legal (really).
Let me SHOW you.
:)
Or not :-(
Can you even imagine ???????????
I Can.
Jerry
--
Jerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA
Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to: snipped-for-privacy@gte.net>
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Jerry Irvine wrote:

Jeeeeeees....who put the quarter in you?!?!?!?!?
Wait, it's saturday night....
I'll take my twin 40's of maddog over your rum-n-cokes any day :)
Ted Novak TRA#5512 IEAS#75
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Jerry Irvine wrote:

Had what??

Jerry, you're delusional. Even if TRA ever became deranged enough to cert your motors, it would not make them legal. You still don't have ATF permits to manufacture them, so in the eyes of the ATF they would be illegal to sell. Nor do you have the DOT permits to ship them, so they'd still be illegal to ship. Club certification would not change these facts.
Furthermore, certification of motors wouldn't erase your felony conviction for possession of a destructive device, which makes you a "prohibited person" according to ATF.

So far you haven't even shown us this alleged "holy grail" referred to in the title of your post, whatever that may be.
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Yes it would.

The MANUFACTURER does (for other purposes entirely), but the ATF has CLEARLY said to them the sport motors are not subject to that permit at any point in time.
I have posted the cites over and over. A judge even concurred and you STILL defame it. You are untrainable.
The good news is the folks that matter, the manufacturer, and the ATF all agree sport motors are all exempt.
ONLY the TRA is out of synch.
Therefore it is a FACT that if TRA simply followed its own rules (I have cited them over and over as well) on motor renewals and required ONLY motors and money in the case of USR just as it does with all its other "manufacturers", then the motors would be available again immediately.

You do not have the authority or expertise to say the exact and precise opposite of the ATF's own statements to the manufacturer. To the extent TRA goes along with this, they are in "restraint of trade".

Jerry
--
Jerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA
Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to: snipped-for-privacy@gte.net>
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points to ponder:
A: the BATFE changes its rules and regs to suit itself at its own whim.
B: BATFE did not go through proper procedures during recent rule making.
C: BATFE has done this several times in the past.
D: TRA certification is beating a dead horse. Have you tried NAR or the Canadians? if so did they say the same. NYET!
E. Per all the fecal material that has been posted here by yourself Mr. Irvine and all the other fecal matter that has flown in responses. I politely ask for you to simply give it up. Unless Moses should return with the next five commandments saying that Irvine is good, Irvine is right. It is not going to happen in my lifetime or yours. All the continued bantering of this matter is doing is embarressing yourself and allowing us to see what a huge waste of basic component chemicals you are.

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Jerry Irvine wrote:

Prove it.

Prove it.

You've posted no cites from the ATF. Where is the ATF's statement saying that your manufacturer doesn't need a LEMP?

Prove it. I've posted a statement from the ATF which says manufacturers DO need a LEMP. If they have since changed that policy, please post their statement saying so.

First off, they do not require "motors and money only" from other manufacturers. All manufacturers must show proof that they are in compliance with ATF, DOT, and state laws. Secondly, even if your problems with ATF went away, you still don't have DOT approvals, nor do you have CSFM permits.

No, I just have the ATF's own statements which I have posted before and will now post again. You have nothing but a record of lying.
http://www.atf.gov/explarson/0504rocketryqa.pdf
In particular, check out question #3... "3. I would like to manufacture and distribute single use rocket motors and/or propellant reload kits. What ATF license is required? Only a manufacturer's license is required. Licensed manufacturers may engage in the business of manufacturing explosive materials for purposes of sale or distribution or for their own use. It is not necessary for a licensed manufacturer to also obtain a dealer's license to engage in business on his or her licensed premises as a dealer in explosive materials. See 27 CFR § 555.41(b)(3)."
That's the ATF's official, published statement saying that they require LEMPs for rocket motor manufacturers. If you have another official statement from them that contradicts that, post it. Also, if it predates their current published position, then it's not their current policy -- it would only be useful for overturning their current policy, through the court.
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Jerry Irvine wrote:

Oh, I forgot one other thing. Even IF your manufacturer was 100% legal, YOU still couldn't get their motors certified. Only the manufacturer can submit motors for certification. Your mystery manufacturer will have to come out from under that cloak of secrecy and submit the motors if they ever want to have them certified.
s
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wrote:

He can maybe submit one motor manufactured by him, then sell those manufactured by his "manufacturer". Like someone certifying a J350 and then make them manufactured by another one.
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michel wrote:

To do that, Jerry would have to be a manufacturer. He says he isn't.
Both he and the other manufacturer would have to have LEMPs and state permits, and of course the motors would have to be legal to ship.
i
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michel wrote:

That's two manufacturers; you need the proper paperwork for both.
-Kevin
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GOOD GOD!
Pardon me for not following this thread, but has anybody noted its length?
1183 messages and counting! It must be some kind of record!
Kevin Trojanowski wrote:

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Brian McDermott wrote:

Yep, and still not even a hint as to what the "grail" of the title is supposed to be.
h
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Probably not yet.
--
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)! <<<
Kaplow Klips & Baffle: http://nira-rocketry.org/Document/MayJun00.pdf
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Bob Kaplow wrote:

Probably a new record for volleys of...
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Is not!
--
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)! <<<
Kaplow Klips & Baffle: http://nira-rocketry.org/Document/MayJun00.pdf
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Bob Kaplow wrote:

Is Too! Is Too! Is Too!
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IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot! IsNot!
--
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)! <<<
Kaplow Klips & Baffle: http://nira-rocketry.org/Document/MayJun00.pdf
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Bob Kaplow wrote:

Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!Is Too!
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I am just glad you made so many copies ALL missing a key space character.
--
Jerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA
Opinion, the whole thing. <mail to: snipped-for-privacy@gte.net>
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While other issues are real, this is a silly TRA-only rule. Under the TRA rule, Quest motors would not be certifiable. Nor would the motors sold under the PML or former Rocketvision labels. And for that matter, neither would the Aerotech by Ellis motors, including the infamous spongy J350.
    Bob Kaplow    NAR # 18L    TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD"         >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD! <<< Kaplow Klips & Baffle:    http://nira-rocketry.org/LeadingEdge/Phantom4000.pdf www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/ www.nira-rocketry.org www.nar.org
People who exercise their embryonic freedom day after day, little by little, expand that freedom. People who do not will find that it withers until they are literally "being lived." They are acting out scripts written by parents, associates, and society. --Stephen R. Covey
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