Union Pacific not a scrooge

snipped-for-privacy@CreditValley.Railway wrote:


Will, you might think it's beyond you now, but that's mainly because you haven't tried it yet! :-)
Certainly it's a good idea to start developing your skills by scratchbuilding some rolling stock, as you have suggested you'll do. But the skills needed to do that are exactly the same as those needed to build a loco, there's just a bit more work involved.
Is there a club near you where you can spend some time, picking the brains of more experienced modellers? While being a clubbie is not for everbody, much useful knowledge can be gained from your fellow members, and useful experience gained by participating in club projects.
Failing that, there have been some good books and articles published over they years on the subject of scratchbuilding steam locos. Most have been written primarily for the novice scratchbuilder, and are an invaluable addition to your modelling library.
Anway, if you want to discuss this further, you're welcome to email me.
All the best,
Mark.
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Hot solder vs cold glue :)

I hear there is one in Bracebridge, about 30KM south of me.

Thanks Mark.
Right now my budget is limited, I have just started a new company (6 months ago) and it is slowly ramping up. Still trying to catch up with startup expenses and pay back a couple of loans.
Is there a location online that has some tips and hints for scratch building rolling stock and buildings?
--
Will
HO - Credit Valley Railway
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snipped-for-privacy@CreditValley.Railway wrote:

Will, have a look at this site:
http://www.geocities.com/budb3 /
Also worth bookmarking.
All the best,
Mark.
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Dear sirs, I could not see your whole thread, but if you are looking for information on scratchbuilding locomotives I would suggest you visit this page:
http://pages.prodigy.net/fugu/railroadlinks.html
There are a lot of Britons building model engines and they publish plenty of stuff on the Internet, too.
Cordially yours, Gerard Pawlowski
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Actually Gerard, I was looking for building plans suitable for an 1880s layout.
I just mentioned that the time period suited 4-4-0s pulling 34' Overtons or 34' Truss Rod box, stock, flat, gondola and reefer units.
--
Will
HO - Credit Valley Railway
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If you are looking for info on 1800's era railroad equipment I suggest you go to Yahoo.com, look under 'Groups' and do a search for 'Early Rail'. Lots of info on equipment, such as paint schemes etc. Bill

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I am modeling the Credit Valley Railway which existed from 1871-1883 and was then absorbed into the Canadian Pacific. Their color scheme was simply black locomotives with a large white "Credit Valley" on the tender and white name on the side of the cab. Rolling stock was boxcar red for the box and stock cars or dark stained natural wood for flats and gondolas.
It is building plans I am looking for. I wish to try and scratch build the structures.
I have found that "Narrow Guage and Short Line Gazette" is by far the best magazine, and they have a couple of plans per month. But I was hoping to locate more.
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Will
HO - Credit Valley Railway
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Gerard Pawlowski wrote:
> Dear sirs, I could not see your whole thread, but if you are looking > for information on scratchbuilding locomotives I would suggest you > visit this page: > > http://pages.prodigy.net/fugu/railroadlinks.html > > There are a lot of Britons building model engines and they publish > plenty of stuff on the Internet, too.
Some good links there, thanks for posting that, Gerard.
Cheers,
Mark.
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Dear Will, Oh. I remember this thread now. I did put one new plan on my own web site (
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/8719/GREENHOUSE.jpg ), which I built but have not yet written up, that would fit that era. Structures are easier than rolling stock, usually, because there are still a lot of houses of the 1880's still around, and once you have learned to remove the modern alterations you can use them. Go to your local historical society (a lot of towns have them) and beg and plead to look through their old photographs. This is a fascinating hobby in its own right, and besides giving you ideas for plans it will also help you know what details to add or take from the modernized old structures that still stand. Around here a lot of the libraries have reprinted copies of an 1876 county atlas that are full of line engravings that show old structures. I remember one in particular, a general store, that still remained nearly as the drawing showed until about ten years ago, when it was adorned with ugly Perma-Stone in an act of innocent barbarism. These seem common in other surrounding counties; I don't know what you might find in Canada. You will be working from engravings and photos, mostly. This is not hard. You just need to use some experience and thought to judge the sizes. People standing nearby are a big help. If you are a little bit off, well, not too many folks are left with us from the 1880's to criticize you. Cordially yours, Gerard Pawlowski
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Jerry) wrote in

A serious modeler would scratchbuild his locomotives and most other parts of his layout, the way that folks did a few years ago. At least, he would do a *lot* of superdetailing on what he purchased. Do you meet either of those standards? Or do you just flop open the checkbook and buy whatever is in the hobby shop that's r-t-r?
I freely admit that, at this point, I am an R-T-R and kit modeler. How about you?
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Keith Norgrove, responding to a comment about the C&NW's now-expired trademarks for "transportation of passengers by railroad and transportation of freight", wrote:

Exactly. Even though the UP's 12-31-02 application for a C&NW trademark has not yet been granted -- and may never be.
Would you buy a used car from someone who said "Well, I don't really own it yet -- but I might at some time in the future"?
JR Hill
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wouldn't have to worry about complaints from the t-shirt and hat merchants.<
This again shows that the UP is attempting to actually make money from doing this and not just protecting trademarks.
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The best thing that can be done on these applications is to file the objections to them based on how the application is written. In this case, somebody needs to point out they're not using the trademark as stated (as they aren't in the business), or perhaps somebody else has prior use, or whatever. A lot of these applications pass because the PTO doesn't have the wherewithal to dig into the weeds to root out all this stuff. See the MTH DCC Back EMF patent to-do.
Those of us who have the information and the ability to make that information available to somebody to fight stuff like this ought to do so. At least to somebody who can file the objections backed up with facts. That's why Stan Ames was looking for older DCC info so they can fight the MTH thing.
Kennedy
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On 31 Dec 2003 21:49:02 GMT, Kennedy (no longer not on The Haggis!)

But they are. By licensing the logos, they control the production of the items. It's a circular world, but for them it may work...
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Frank A. Rosenbaum wrote:

Are you referring to "Broderbund" clip art?
"Broderbund" is the name under which the company does business, and it has a registered trademark (Serial Number 73413436, Registration Number 1306829) for that name when used in connection with the sale of computer software, including the "ClickArt" clip-art graphics application. The tradename "ClickArt" is also a registered trademark (Serial Number 73479993, Registration Number 1316792).
The clip-art itself is not trademarked but IS protected by copyright, which is automatic (does it strike you as odd that a company selling clip-art software for use in creating "business publications" would want a license if you actually USE the software for its intended purpose . . . :-)
The difference between the UP and Broderbund is this: Broderbund sells its products under its trademarked name. The UP, on the other hand, does NOT make or sell model trains under any of the fallen-flag railroad names it wants to trademark.
JR Hill
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Jim Hill wrote:

I was using the clipart as my logo for my publications. I asked permission, they gave it to me for no charge. THAT was the point I was making.
UP can protect their trademarks and not charge anything for it.

-- Please note; return email address has changed. It is now snipped-for-privacy@sbcglobal.net. Emails to Earthlink will be ignored.
The Gratiot Valley Railroad Club bi-annual train show and sale March 7, 2004, at the Macomb Community College Sports and Expo Center. Macomb County Michigan. Please visit our Web Site at: www.gvrr.org
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Any halfway decent IP attorney will tell you that doing such offers little or no protection in the eyes of the courts. Nearly all legal counsel will advise you that free licensing agreements are a very bad idea when it comes to protecting trademarks...
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or no protection in the eyes of the courts< No decent attorney will tell anyone anything that does not lead to a following income. For goodness sake folks they teach it in school.
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Because UP has a bunch of rich lawyers and execs who need bonus money. The hate railfans and modelers and wonder why they loose jury trials.
Emails to Earthlink will be

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Hi Jerry
I would agree with you that the additional cost is not gonna be a backbreaker when purchasing equipment. I guess what bugs me is that for almost 100 years, the model railroading industry did not have to pay anything for the use of their logo, and we used the logos and names with model railroading pride. I don't know of any misuse or derogatory ways in which the UP logos were used by modelers. Also, if I felt UP really needed this extra income stream, then maybe I would be more sympathetic. But I don't think they do. Anyway, our opinions won't matter much to UP so I guess we're all stuck with it, or we can purchase non UP equipment.
Happy Holidays Chris
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